|
Dune
Mar 11, 2024 16:26:33 GMT
via mobile
Post by oldschoolsavant on Mar 11, 2024 16:26:33 GMT
Again: the original theatrical release is my Head Cannon. Ahem. And the comment about Paul completing a "his hero journey" at the end of Lynch's film doesn't quite hit home for myself personally. Between the shout overkill cracking Sting apart, the whole "I control the spice now" and the mythical rainmaker, it's apparent that he's become something far, far more powerful and worse. One thing I'm still not keen on is the lack of Navigation Guild compared to Lynch's, not only as they are behind the scenes string pullers, but they are the whole reason for spice being essential, and hasn't really been conveyed much in Villneuve's, probably to avoid the oil angle. I can't remember the books exactly but isn't it their premise to want someone stable/controllable in charge of spice to keep interstellar travel stable, and they already know Paul isn't it ? They also provide a touch of foreshadowing for wormPaul. Don't inhale drugs kids ! .
|
|
|
Dune
Mar 11, 2024 16:56:51 GMT
Post by harrypalmer on Mar 11, 2024 16:56:51 GMT
I can understand the omission of the guild. Villeneuve would have had to either invent a guild character or have some exposition about them. They're heavily discussed in the book but there's no guild character. the story works without them, but I'd have loved a little bit about them using spice to plot a course through space, would have been cool.
|
|
Phattso
Junior Member
Posts: 1,956
Member is Online
|
Post by Phattso on Mar 11, 2024 16:58:18 GMT
You can only imagine they're doing to go big on the Navigation Guild (and a bunch of other shit) if they make Part Three.
Kind of a nice ace to have up yer sleeve. See also: Gholas. Although I haven't seen Part Two yet, so maybe they're already there.
|
|
|
Dune
Mar 11, 2024 17:04:46 GMT
Onny likes this
Post by britesparc on Mar 11, 2024 17:04:46 GMT
I have to say, the absolute balls of the movie to basically end on a cliffhanger when there's no guarantee at all that he'd be allowed to make part three/Messiah. Of course now the film is a huge success - almost certainly it'll take over $500m - so I think he'll be getting on with more Dune in short order, but still.
The book, although relatively open-ended, still felt like a complete work to me, whereas as this definitely feels like the middle of a trilogy.
|
|
zephro
Junior Member
Posts: 2,988
|
Post by zephro on Mar 12, 2024 0:10:52 GMT
Well I saw it today and enjoyed it a lot. Just the gob-smacking awe of it all, the colossal architecture, the desert and the horror of the story. Really captures the book and god it's just one of the best looking films I've seen. I thought not shoe horning a navigator, explanation of CHOAM or the Landstradt etc. were all sensible moves considering how long the 2 movies are together anyhow. Then giving Channi more to do that just be the love interest and giving Irulan some actual fucking lines. I think it cleaves to the actual spirit of the book better than the other adaptations I've seen. Also not having talking baby Alia is probably wise even if it made the time scale a bit weird, as it's clearly all within a few months rather than years of guerrilla warfare. But if the alternative is talking baby... fine. Also in terms of Paul's path and decision making with regards to the books: Basically my memory of the books is that Paul sees the narrow path through in Dune. The path to survive, not get murdered by the Harkonen's and free the Fremen. Which as the other noble houses gather around Arrakis and threaten to invade involves countering it with the Jihad.
His full motivation and revelation is really only in Dune: Messiah, Children of Dune and God Emperor of Dune. As at the end of Messiah he does balk at the Golden Path. Turning into a hybrid sand-worm, destroying the spice and collapsing humanity into a 3,000 year dark age where they worship him as a god. Though you only fully find out what that meant in book 3 and 4 because his son Leto II actually goes and does it. His motivations at the end of Dune are liberating the Freman and not getting Arrakis invaded and himself killed. From my memory anyhow. At the end of Messiah all you actually know is that there's something WORSE than the Jihad which he won't do.
|
|
|
Dune
Mar 12, 2024 19:48:37 GMT
Post by ToomuchFluffy on Mar 12, 2024 19:48:37 GMT
Wasn't the biggest fan unfortunately. The second half of the first movie already had some issues* and Part 2 did feel often feel like just another rendition of a movie I have seen many times before. It still often has a lot of style and can be really impressive at times, but the love story was rather run-of-the-mill, the ideological conflict didn't really add much and the Fremen are essentially still noble savages that are being used as supermen and ultimately as a deus ex machina. The latter is consistent with the book though.
A bit too much use of the "Voice". Those moments seem to mostly be there to portray Paul's mother as a sinister figure and to simply spice up things for the movie-goers occasionally. The music was just brute force from beginning to end. It kind of works, but a lot of the time I felt it only really was there to batter the viewer into submission.
*the unnecessary Boromir moment, the extremely long overdone Ornithopter crash sequence etc.
|
|
malek86
Junior Member
Pomegranate Deseeder
Posts: 3,247
|
Dune
Mar 15, 2024 6:26:53 GMT
via mobile
Post by malek86 on Mar 15, 2024 6:26:53 GMT
Not sure about the rival baldy, he gets hyped a lot and then just kinda goes down in what even the other characters deem a completely unnecessary fight, since he was at their mercy anyway.
Other than that, it was a good movie. Great use of music and visuals. I liked the first part better though. Felt more scifi.
|
|
Lizard
Junior Member
I love ploughmans
Posts: 4,481
|
Dune
Mar 16, 2024 7:42:06 GMT
Post by Lizard on Mar 16, 2024 7:42:06 GMT
Finally saw it, very good. Only criticisms would be that Paul's visions were a bit tame and Austin Butler's ridiculous voice.
|
|
|
Dune
Mar 16, 2024 9:10:50 GMT
via mobile
Post by Reviewer on Mar 16, 2024 9:10:50 GMT
I’m definitely giving up on cineworld though. I hadn’t realised just how washed out and dim it looked until I had another quick watch of the trailer. It was like watching it with 50% lower saturation and 50% brightness which makes it even more impressive that it still liked really good.
|
|
nazo
Junior Member
Posts: 1,301
|
Dune
Mar 16, 2024 9:27:17 GMT
via mobile
Post by nazo on Mar 16, 2024 9:27:17 GMT
I seem to remember the same thing about the other Harkonnen from the book, it spent ages building him up and then he didn’t really do much. Maybe the Bene Gesserit securing his bloodline will be significant later but I never felt compelled to read any more. His voice stood out as not really matching him somehow, I’m not familiar with the actor so wasn’t sure if that’s just how he is?
|
|
|
Dune
Mar 16, 2024 9:37:23 GMT
via mobile
Post by simple on Mar 16, 2024 9:37:23 GMT
Are we talking about Feyd? because he’s always been a chump
|
|
|
Dune
Mar 16, 2024 9:56:42 GMT
via mobile
askew and Tomo like this
Post by dasbooter on Mar 16, 2024 9:56:42 GMT
I thought his voice was fantastic, it really matched Skarsgaard's
|
|
Lizard
Junior Member
I love ploughmans
Posts: 4,481
|
Dune
Mar 17, 2024 5:16:42 GMT
via mobile
ekz and otto like this
Post by Lizard on Mar 17, 2024 5:16:42 GMT
How do they get off the sandworms?
|
|
MolarAm🔵
Full Member
Bad at games
Posts: 6,839
|
Post by MolarAm🔵 on Mar 17, 2024 6:25:29 GMT
By cutting to a different scene where they're off the sandworms.
|
|
|
Dune
Mar 17, 2024 8:18:21 GMT
via mobile
Onny and otto like this
Post by simple on Mar 17, 2024 8:18:21 GMT
I think getting off with worms is more a book three kind of story
|
|
|
Post by atomix on Mar 17, 2024 9:54:39 GMT
The Life of Brian, “only the messiah would say he isn’t the messiah” bit at the start was my biggest chuckle.
|
|
Rich
Junior Member
Posts: 1,984
|
Dune
Mar 17, 2024 11:48:31 GMT
via mobile
Post by Rich on Mar 17, 2024 11:48:31 GMT
We watched it last night and enjoyed it. I was quite surprised how close they kept to the book for a lot of it even if they toned down just how much of a dick Paul was by the end of it.
|
|
|
Dune
Mar 19, 2024 7:35:46 GMT
via mobile
otto likes this
Post by zisssou on Mar 19, 2024 7:35:46 GMT
Phew that was a lot to take in. I need to watch it again, but in private, with no one coughing in the back row.
|
|
otto
New Member
Posts: 956
|
Post by otto on Mar 19, 2024 16:33:24 GMT
Yeah I need to give it a second watch without a big fuck-off bald shirtless geezer covered in tattoos scoffing crisps endlessly then going out and getting more crisps and eating them too and then starting on yet another five packets and then sending his missus out to get some more AND THEN EATING THEM sat in front of me
|
|
Zyrr
New Member
Posts: 986
|
Post by Zyrr on Mar 19, 2024 16:55:03 GMT
I absolutely hate people eating in the cinema. If it was up to me I'd ban all food during screenings, but at the very least they should only sell soft, quiet foodstuffs that don't disturb everyone within earshot. Took one of the kids to see Godzilla Minus One before Christmas and a guy in front of us ate a seemingly endless box of really smelly nachos in the loudest, most obnoxious way imaginable for at least half of the film. Blood pressure's gone up just thinking about it
|
|
Onny
Junior Member
Posts: 1,150
|
Dune
Mar 19, 2024 17:47:49 GMT
via mobile
otto likes this
Post by Onny on Mar 19, 2024 17:47:49 GMT
Yeah I need to give it a second watch without a big fuck-off bald shirtless geezer covered in tattoos scoffing crisps endlessly then going out and getting more crisps and eating them too and then starting on yet another five packets and then sending his missus out to get some more AND THEN EATING THEM sat in front of me I just really like crisps ok.
|
|
Onny
Junior Member
Posts: 1,150
|
Dune
Mar 19, 2024 17:48:58 GMT
via mobile
otto likes this
Post by Onny on Mar 19, 2024 17:48:58 GMT
I’m halfway through the book now and I’m struck by how many differences there are. Very much enjoying it though.
|
|
|
Dune
Mar 20, 2024 12:14:20 GMT
Post by gibroon on Mar 20, 2024 12:14:20 GMT
I'm watching the mini series which is quite wonderfully dated but it just struck me, what do the Fremen eat? Meal worm?
There is a lot of talk about water but fuck all about food. Are there any gastro pubs?
|
|
|
Dune
Mar 20, 2024 12:19:52 GMT
Post by gamingdave on Mar 20, 2024 12:19:52 GMT
How do they get off the sandworms? And how do they get more than one person on them? Does the brave Fremen who managed to anchor themselves do a U-turn then parallel park next to their mates?
|
|
|
Dune
Mar 20, 2024 12:24:49 GMT
Post by gibroon on Mar 20, 2024 12:24:49 GMT
How do they get off the sandworms? And how do they get more than one person on them? Does the brave Fremen who managed to anchor themselves do a U-turn then parallel park next to their mates? I think this is done better in David Lynch's Dune. They all scale the same worm themselves. How Jessica and her large elephant seat and entourage made it on top of a sandworm is quite impressive and made me giggle a little when watching the new film.
|
|
otto
New Member
Posts: 956
|
Dune
Mar 20, 2024 13:03:46 GMT
Post by otto on Mar 20, 2024 13:03:46 GMT
I'm watching the mini series which is quite wonderfully dated but it just struck me, what do the Fremen eat? Meal worm? There is a lot of talk about water but fuck all about food. Are there any gastro pubs? "spice heavy diet" they eat sand, my friend, they eat spice-heavy sand. And muad'dib fritters.
|
|
otto
New Member
Posts: 956
|
Post by otto on Mar 20, 2024 13:06:48 GMT
And how do they get more than one person on them? Does the brave Fremen who managed to anchor themselves do a U-turn then parallel park next to their mates? I think this is done better in David Lynch's Dune. They all scale the same worm themselves. How Jessica and her large elephant seat and entourage made it on top of a sandworm is quite impressive and made me giggle a little when watching the new film. This is actually explained in the book. So you open up a segment exposing the pink sensitive bits that the worm tries to keep as far away from the sand as possible, much as you do at the beach yourself, and then you sort of strafe to the side so the worm keeps rotating and your mates just bung in a hook and get brought to the top just as you would in a paternoster lift. It's all perfectly straightforward. This is also how you turn your worm.
|
|
|
Dune
Mar 20, 2024 13:48:11 GMT
via mobile
Post by 😎 on Mar 20, 2024 13:48:11 GMT
To get off you also wait until the worm is tired enough to not give a shit about eating you once you climb down. The Fremen measure distance in the number of worms it’ll take to cross it.
|
|
otto
New Member
Posts: 956
|
Dune
Mar 20, 2024 14:00:11 GMT
Post by otto on Mar 20, 2024 14:00:11 GMT
Yeah it's essentially battery swap tech instead of recharge.
|
|
Tomo
Junior Member
Posts: 3,488
|
Dune
Mar 21, 2024 23:20:04 GMT
Post by Tomo on Mar 21, 2024 23:20:04 GMT
Might need to watch it again but I missed the bit where he saw that the human race gets wiped out unless he does the war thing, just seemed like he switched suddenly. He doesn't specifically say that, I don't think. But I'm pretty sure that the "I have to do terrible things, or even more terrible things will happen" thing gets mentioned. But the point is that, especially after he drinks the water, he can see the future (or at least thinks he can see the future). Like, far into the future, and all possibilities for that future. That's basically most of his reason for doing what he does. He does it because he thinks he has to, not because he wants to. Maybe the movie didn't explain that well enough? It's a bit difficult for me to tell, because my brain automatically supplants it with details from the books. Just watched it today and having not read the books I had a similar lack of clarity, so this helps with my understanding. I got the drink water = see future bit, but didn't make the leap to Paul becomes pragmatic so starts the holy war as the best of terrible options. At the end I was left more with a feeling of "Paul is making some kind of IQ200 move here, hence he's taken the hand of the Emperor's daughter, much to the chagrin of Chani"
|
|