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Post by mothercruncher on Jan 5, 2022 11:27:39 GMT
I wonder how sales of Corona are doing these days?
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richardiox
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Post by richardiox on Jan 5, 2022 11:29:23 GMT
I think that with the amount of community transmission at the moment the 5 day thing will make fuck all difference. You can remove those 30% from the pool of potential vectors and it still leaves an insanely huge pool.
Omicron has really changed the game in terms of what interventions will make a difference. Basically impossible to get R under 1 right?
And isn't it a case you can only leave isolation after 5 days IF you test negative for two consecutive days on LFT? In which case that 30% figure would surely come down a fair bit.
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Post by grey_matters on Jan 5, 2022 11:33:09 GMT
Really? I thought they mutation was effectively sped up evolution. They adapt to survive, which in this case means becoming more contagious and less severe. Is that just received wisdom? Exactly yeah. Yes the mutations are random but survival of the fittest decides which ones actually take hold. In this case they think the fact that it grows much better in the upper respiratory tissue makes it much more contagious. With the bonus of it being way less severe as it's not getting into the lungs nearly as much. Looking at it logically I can't see how another strain which sits in the lungs again can really outcompete if they're right. Unfortunately I can, but I don't want to introduce too much speculative negativity to this thread (I'm fine with it but I hadn't appreciated the effect it has had on others). And thankfully I'm no expert anyway. I'm liking the evolution/mutation discussion. Afaik, the 'survival of the fittest' is a bit over played. It is often just survival, not a metric of quality-of-fit. Sure, in narrow niches it becomes the same thing but in wide messy systems you can have wide range of messy solutions.
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Post by Reviewer on Jan 5, 2022 12:12:01 GMT
Worth noting the Spanish flu, as mentioned in that article I linked, came from a mutation.
(Being positive) It’s entirely possible omicron being so infectious means everyone ends up with a level of immunity resulting in some stronger defence against future mutations but I’ve no idea.
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Post by elstoof on Jan 5, 2022 12:19:43 GMT
Your article says Spanish flu came from birds and mutated to become more easily transmitted through humans
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111
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Post by 111 on Jan 5, 2022 12:21:27 GMT
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111
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Post by 111 on Jan 5, 2022 13:48:34 GMT
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Post by khanivor on Jan 5, 2022 13:59:57 GMT
It’s good that we have a firm handle on long Covid and all the implications that the virus will have on human health following infection, now that the consensus is ‘fuck it, get the Rona cold abs be free’
Hopefully the study suggesting 30% of infected have auto immune issues turns out to be bunk after peer review
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EMarkM
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Post by EMarkM on Jan 5, 2022 14:03:06 GMT
Abs be free indeed o7
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スコットランド
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Post by スコットランド on Jan 5, 2022 14:07:36 GMT
Just been chatting with my mate from work who got mild covid very early on, she still has heart issues from long covid, pain and fatigue, over 18 months now. Long covid scares me more than getting seriously ill.
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Tuffty
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Post by Tuffty on Jan 5, 2022 14:10:13 GMT
Yeah for me, long covid effects are the biggest fear. Guy at work got it a few months back and still can't taste anything. That's not a life I wanna live so I'm still wanting covid to get the fuck away from me. It's something people aren't talking about either when they talk about the risks of catching it.
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111
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Post by 111 on Jan 5, 2022 14:14:17 GMT
It’s good that we have a firm handle on long Covid and all the implications that the virus will have on human health following infection, now that the consensus is ‘fuck it, get the Rona cold abs be free’ Hopefully the study suggesting 30% of infected have auto immune issues turns out to be bunk after peer review Isn't it more that there's not a lot we can do about preventing any long-term health impacts...? We've never been able to stop the thing from spreading - just slow it down enough that not so many people get it at the same time that they don't fit in the hospitals.
If long-term impacts are widespread and serious then, yes, that will be very shit. How does that inform what we do now though?
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Post by 😎 on Jan 5, 2022 14:23:14 GMT
I don’t believe that “fuck it” is the consensus, at least not among the medical community. What is being appreciated though is that short of a complete military style lockdown which isn’t going to happen for a ton of reasons, there’s no stopping the spread of Omicron and it’s being assumed that pretty much everyone is going to get it, regardless of quarantine length, social distancing, mask wearing etc. Any of our existing protocols for the public are effectively useless at containing or slowing it. There’s some research now that short of proper PPE, cloth and paper masks are ineffective due to the sheer viral load and infectiousness of Omicron. Obviously long term impacts are still a concern and research and studies of it are ramping up as we speak, but there’s basically nothing that can be done right now to prevent or slow the spread. It’s the most infectious thing on the planet.
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Post by khanivor on Jan 5, 2022 14:46:26 GMT
There’s plenty that can be done to stop the spread. However, at this point way too many people ‘don’t wanna’ so it’s “fuck it” instead
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Post by 😎 on Jan 5, 2022 14:51:55 GMT
Sorry, but no. There’s not plenty that can be done to prevent the spread. Delay it fractionally, sure, but omicron has blasted through the planet in under a month. People should obviously keep doing sensible precautions, protect the immunocompromised, etc etc, but like I said, short of some more national lockdowns it’s a done deal right now.
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スコットランド
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Post by スコットランド on Jan 5, 2022 14:54:02 GMT
there’s basically nothing that can be done right now to prevent or slow the spread. It’s the most infectious thing on the planet. That's not true. There are plenty of effective measures, wearing of FFP2 or FFP3 masks, distancing and ensuring adequate ventilation for a start.
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Post by 😎 on Jan 5, 2022 14:55:48 GMT
That isn’t going to prevent, only delay, and do so marginally. And I’m not sure the logistical problem of supplying a planets worth of decent PPE to everyone will outpace the spread.
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Post by khanivor on Jan 5, 2022 14:57:27 GMT
A national lockdown is something that can be done but ‘internet wanna’
So, as I said, we can stop it but “fuck it”
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Lukus
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Post by Lukus on Jan 5, 2022 15:00:48 GMT
I don’t believe that “fuck it” is the consensus, at least not among the medical community. What is being appreciated though is that short of a complete military style lockdown which isn’t going to happen for a ton of reasons, there’s no stopping the spread of Omicron and it’s being assumed that pretty much everyone is going to get it, regardless of quarantine length, social distancing, mask wearing etc. Any of our existing protocols for the public are effectively useless at containing or slowing it. There’s some research now that short of proper PPE, cloth and paper masks are ineffective due to the sheer viral load and infectiousness of Omicron. Obviously long term impacts are still a concern and research and studies of it are ramping up as we speak, but there’s basically nothing that can be done right now to prevent or slow the spread. It’s the most infectious thing on the planet. Other than your smile
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mrpon
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Post by mrpon on Jan 5, 2022 15:01:32 GMT
Phwoar!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2022 15:02:23 GMT
A national lockdown is something that can be done but ‘internet wanna’ So, as I said, we can stop it but “fuck it” You can delay it. By a small amount at best. Every single person in the world is going to need to be exposed to it, multiple times. It's not going anywhere.
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111
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Post by 111 on Jan 5, 2022 15:03:54 GMT
A national lockdown is something that can be done but ‘internet wanna’ So, as I said, we can stop it but “fuck it” So close everything for 20 years while we establish what the long-term health impacts are...?
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Post by elstoof on Jan 5, 2022 15:03:57 GMT
You have to weigh up the implications of a lockdown on mental health, childrens development and education etc against what aleffect it will have on the virus spreading though, and that comes down to “how badly do we need to slow it down a little bit”
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Post by 😎 on Jan 5, 2022 15:06:18 GMT
A national lockdown can’t happen, at least not in the US. The economy can’t support it, the people won’t support it, the current supply chain issues can’t support it, it would ultimately cause more problems than it would solve and it would still only delay the inevitable, and long Covid will still be a problem. It’s naive and simplistic to think that it can happen at the click of a fingers and that it’ll turn out beneficial. Long Covid is one of about seventy zillion factors in population health decisions, and while it’s a big concern and efforts are ramping up regarding it, it’s not the be all and end all of outcomes.
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スコットランド
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Post by スコットランド on Jan 5, 2022 15:09:36 GMT
That isn’t going to prevent, only delay, and do so marginally. And I’m not sure the logistical problem of supplying a planets worth of decent PPE to everyone will outpace the spread. Concerning the usage of FFP2 masks, I don't know about the whole planet but you can find them very easily, I buy them in the supermarket. It was never given much importance with the public despite the protection being enormously greater than with surgical masks. They do "slow down spread". Delta became dominant incredibly quickly as well but wasn't at the absolute worst time of year, unlike omicron. Omicron is clearly much more infectious, that can't be argued but measures don't just stop working completely.
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Post by elstoof on Jan 5, 2022 15:12:02 GMT
Wait and see how effective this new Ontario lockdown is at slowing it down I guess
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スコットランド
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Post by スコットランド on Jan 5, 2022 15:13:24 GMT
The girl I mentioned earlier who's had over 18 months of long covid just found out that her 85 year old dad who is in hospital and has a dodgy ticker, just got infected in hospital
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geefe
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Post by geefe on Jan 5, 2022 15:13:32 GMT
The other factor in masks, for me, is the massive issue for the planet. I remember seeing bins full of them at the hospital I worked at as staff took them off at the end of the day.
The environment impact is huge, too.
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Post by Trowel 🏴 on Jan 5, 2022 15:14:58 GMT
Hahahah
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Post by 😎 on Jan 5, 2022 15:15:41 GMT
They don’t stop working, and I’ve never suggested that “do away with masks” is the right thing to do, but it’s still just a finger in the dam against the current spread, even less so with basic cloth and paper masks which are still the most common in use.
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