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Post by skalpadda on Oct 23, 2023 14:11:19 GMT
I think Wyll is probably the character I hate the most. The personality, the horniness, that stupid fucking vest. I wish you had the opportunity to murder him like you can with Gale and Asterion. Constantly referring to himself as "The Blade" in the 3rd person. |
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Tuffty
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Post by Tuffty on Oct 23, 2023 14:58:05 GMT
I think Wyll's fine, he has more going on to him than I thought with his connection to Mizora. Wanna see what happens there. It's just for a swashbuckling protector of the innocent thats also bound to a contract with an infernal demon, he is actually the least interesting party member which says a lot.
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zephro
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Post by zephro on Oct 23, 2023 17:30:00 GMT
Haven't really been getting any chances to play recently, so I've sort of stalled in Act 3 a bit. I did the Bhaalist Temple last night - after the massive set piece ending of Act 2, I was expecting the fight with Orin to be a lot more... spectacular.
It wasn't.
She had a LOT of mobs (and Halsin tied to a table), so I didn't really feel like talking to her, so I rushed in and chain lightninged her and her mobs (killing a load of the lower end ones) and aggroing her into beast mode. At which point, she jumped into the middle of my party with "Unstoppable", got smacked about by Lae'zel and Astarion until she wasn't unstoppable any more, then a couple of magic crits from Shadowheart and my Sorceror and she was dead. Sit down, bitch.
The mobs were easy to clean up. Either I'm too much for these fools, or she wasn't as tough as she had made herself out to be.
I guess beautiful blood sprays are not everything. Since I came down from the 2nd playthrough high, I've been thinking BG3 is actually a bit lacking relative to the first 2 in one key part. Which is the actual plot / antagonists. Rather than the writing which is generally great, or the stories within it which are likewise great. Anyway spoilers about the ending and Dark Urge:
The Big Brain is a bit of a let down, it's not there for most the plot and has strong, the massive CGI fight, at the end of a superhero movie vibes.
It kinda feels like the chosen ought to have more oomph to their moments as they're the actual antagonists. Orin especially, as yknow Bhaal... But Orin and WhatsHisFace are introduced at the end of Act 2 and you take them out relatively quick. So it lacks a bit of investment. Ketheric has more screen time in Ac2 and build up in Act 1, but you again take him out pretty quick. So its a bit of a let down.
But also Orin or Gortash, ought to be the culmination I guess but just don't feel that epic.
This goes doubly so for the Dark Urge, which spoiler, you're a Bhaalspawn. So the fight with Orin has a bigger pay-off and works way better. But because that's entirely optional it doesn't really entwine itself into the plot fully. It's also not the ending as you still have to go fight a big floaty brain.
Where as BG1/2/ToB, the fights with Sarevok, Irenicus and Amelyssan are fucking epic and the strands of the plot fully come together at that culmination point. Also they just have a bit more too them around agency, destiny, inheritance etc. Because being the Bhaalspawn is not optional, the scenes relating to it are integral instead. The brain tadpoles just aren't as interesting for some reason.
Anyway I suspect it's mostly because the game is so designed as a Sandbox experience (the order of Gortash and Orin, or siding with them are all optional), so it just can't pull it's strands together into a cohesive whole in quite the same way.
Plus voice of David Warner > floaty brain
I will still be replaying it as a fucking evil assassin shadow monk mind as what a sandbox it is. |
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Post by skalpadda on Oct 24, 2023 3:23:44 GMT
I think I made a similar complaint after finishing it the first time (being vague instead of spoiler tagging), that the main bad guys in Act 3 just feel a bit lightweight and the very end doesn't have enough punch to it. In the grand scheme of things it's not a big deal and it's the only real complaint I have for the whole game. At least (Act 3 spoiler) Raphael gets a glorious sendoff if you decide to fight him. |
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alastair
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Post by alastair on Oct 24, 2023 11:26:59 GMT
I think I made a similar complaint after finishing it the first time (being vague instead of spoiler tagging), that the main bad guys in Act 3 just feel a bit lightweight and the very end doesn't have enough punch to it. In the grand scheme of things it's not a big deal and it's the only real complaint I have for the whole game. If this is due to higher level parties being super powerful and it being harder to provide a balanced challenge then it just goes to show how this game is such a great implementation of the 5e rules!! 😆 |
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Post by skalpadda on Oct 24, 2023 12:30:46 GMT
It's more how they're written and the way it's paced, but certainly the power creep towards the end of the game removes some of the gravity as well.
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dogbot
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Post by dogbot on Oct 24, 2023 12:42:23 GMT
It's more how they're written and the way it's paced, but certainly the power creep towards the end of the game removes some of the gravity as well. That's definitely how I felt. In my example above, the big bad was nowhere near as big or as bad as JK Simmons was in act 2. Not even close, it didn't have the weight in the story or the battle. Hmmm. Although, thinking about it, is that perhaps intentional? Ketheric Thorn was a hugely powerful undead warrior priest with the wisdom of ages and of the man he was before he fell at his beck. Orin... well, she seemed like a little girl who liked blood a lot? She wasn't written with any gravitas. Thorn had pathos and depth. Plus his battle was in two really difficult halves. I dunno.  |
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Post by skalpadda on Oct 24, 2023 13:24:25 GMT
Somewhat intentional for sure, the edgelord scenery-chewing is turned up so much that it's just hard to take her seriously at all. She's also a bit of a pretender who wasn't supposed to be Bhaal's champion. It's not bad as such, but then the other two aren't particularly imposing either. Gortash is just a dude and despite his supposed political masterminding he never came across as imposing or particularly devious to me. Also he looks like he's cosplaying Noel Fielding.
And it's hard to feel intimidated by a giant space brain wearing a tiara no matter how powerful it is. I certainly don't hate them or anything and they're all entertaining in their own right, it's just a little silly and doesn't quite gel with how seriously the stakes are presented. In contrast I think Raphael strikes a better balance despite being super theatrical, or the Emperor who you spend enough time with to give him a lot more depth. |
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Post by Vandelay on Oct 24, 2023 14:03:48 GMT
I was quite disappointed in Jason Issac's performance as Gortash. He sounds a bit bored by it all, when he is normally great. I think we needed to spend more time with those two (Thorm, as well) and they should have definitely been more openly introduced during act 1. They just get thrown in a bit towards the end of Act 2 and it is all a bit rushed. Orin and Bhaal stuff works better (I'm not familiar with the past games, but I understand Bhaal is prominent in those, so I imagine that works even better if you have been following the series), but Gortash suffers a lot from just being chucked in during the final third of the game. Orin cropping up as other NPCs and then kidnapping one of you party also makes her a far more interesting antagonist for you than Gortash, who just spends his time sitting in his castle, rarely interacting with you. There is a real sense of Orin following you and watching your every move, ready to fuck with you at any turn. Gortash only pops up when you are about to fuck with his plans. Agree that Raphael is handled better. His fight is also a lot more epic than the other two, even if it is, as you say, very pantomime. |
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zephro
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Post by zephro on Oct 24, 2023 17:30:05 GMT
Raphael clearly has the best voice acting and would generally work like a badass antagonist.
I quite liked Orin, her just popping up in other people's skins and just being pure Bhaal. Which in le old days is very Chaotic Evil. So yknow psychotic bloodlust and poor planning.
Gortash is boring. Ketheric is interesting but you just don't get to know him enough for it to have weight in the end. No Irenicus, also there's no particular personal beef with him. Actually with the exception of the Dark Urge (which is only partially integrated due to being optional), you've got very little personal beef with any of them.
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Post by skalpadda on Oct 24, 2023 19:50:39 GMT
In Orin's favour I'll say that I was genuinely creeped out by the scene where I found out that Halsin had been kidnapped. This was the second playthrough, but it took so long to happen after reaching Act 3 that I'd forgotten about it and I didn't catch on to what was happening at first. A bit more of that sort of thing rather than just random psychotic cackling would have been really nice. |
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zephro
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Post by zephro on Oct 24, 2023 20:09:14 GMT
Variety is the spice of life. Too many people do more psychological understandable villains nowadays. A cackling madwoman, who gives no fucks, is a nice change of pace.
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RobEG
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Post by RobEG on Oct 24, 2023 21:41:11 GMT
So I had to bring an end to play time this evening as the whole family were up and things seemed like they were going to get, shall we say, intimate.
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Post by LegendaryApe on Oct 25, 2023 5:34:34 GMT
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ekz
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O_o
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Post by ekz on Oct 25, 2023 6:16:15 GMT
Thank you for the rare blessings you bestow upon us Sir Ape.
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RobEG
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Post by RobEG on Oct 25, 2023 6:56:46 GMT
Haha, yeah in the game of course  Jumped back on quickly a bit later…. Sadly, as in real life, my digital romance skills are somewhat lacking. |
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RobEG
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Post by RobEG on Oct 25, 2023 21:33:15 GMT
Damn, this game. You think you are going on a little side quest or just exploring a bit and you end up in some hag’s underground lair . I made the wrong decision a bit earlier on the path though, which is a shame. It’s also something could easily be completed missed with a different dialogue choice. |
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Post by jeepers on Oct 26, 2023 6:29:18 GMT
Had a fun battle in the Goblin Camp yesterday involving two choke points, two Clouds of Daggers and nine or so Goblins Dashing into them in a single turn. All dead bar one who then spent the rest of the battle twanging crossbow bolts at me in a huff.
Now in a burning house where the camera is not my best friend and I can’t figure out why I can’t jump across a small gap after climbing an external ladder…
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alastair
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Post by alastair on Oct 26, 2023 6:49:47 GMT
Had a fun battle in the Goblin Camp yesterday involving two choke points, two Clouds of Daggers and nine or so Goblins Dashing into them in a single turn. All dead bar one who then spent the rest of the battle twanging crossbow bolts at me in a huff. Such a great feeling when your strategic plan pays off! |
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RobEG
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Post by RobEG on Oct 26, 2023 22:05:40 GMT
That whole Auntie Ethel thing was super weird and creepy. |
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Post by dasbooter on Oct 27, 2023 5:04:57 GMT
That whole Auntie Ethel thing was super weird and creepy. Yep, if there's been a boss so far that I really wanted to kill it was her.
The woman you rescue was super moaney. But I can summon her dead zombie husband at will now and he's quite useful for acting as a distraction or scouting out dangerous areas. I'm near the end of Act 1 now. The area of Grymforge is quite nice - real Khazad Dum vibes in one particular spot. . The boss fight against the Forge Guard was a real ball ache though, took me several attempts even after having read up the method. Nice Sauron-esque helmet reward though. |
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Post by salaman on Oct 27, 2023 6:39:34 GMT
Earlier this week, I managed to win a fight but everyone in my party was unconscious.  |
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RobEG
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Post by RobEG on Oct 27, 2023 7:48:49 GMT
dasbooterI feel I may regret my choice at the end. I freed the girl and got a bonus point but she was so ungrateful, and let’s be honest, really fucking stupid! And the hag is still at large . How do you get to summon her husband ?
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RobEG
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Post by RobEG on Oct 27, 2023 7:52:39 GMT
I really like Karlach now. Her and and a dual wielding Astorian as the attack with my Jack of all trades Bard and Shadowheart in support seems to be working well. I do want to use Gale more, but I don’t know who to drop.
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MolarAm🔵
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Post by MolarAm🔵 on Oct 27, 2023 8:00:21 GMT
I think just in terms of personality, Karlach is my favourite hang. A smidge too thirsty to start with, but I admire her enthusiasm.
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alastair
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Post by alastair on Oct 27, 2023 8:25:13 GMT
I killed Karlach when we met her..
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MolarAm🔵
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Post by MolarAm🔵 on Oct 27, 2023 8:27:29 GMT
Oh she is 100% dying in my current playthrough. I consider it a mercy, because I'll be doing things that she definitely will not be up for.
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alastair
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Post by alastair on Oct 27, 2023 10:13:16 GMT
Oh she is 100% dying in my current playthrough. I consider it a mercy, because I'll be doing things that she definitely will not be up for. Oooh matron! |
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Post by Mark1412 on Oct 27, 2023 10:48:04 GMT
I'm a huge fan of Lae-Zel's causticity and complete contempt for everything and everyone. Also love that it's easy to get four attacks in on a single go with her. Biggest issue I have is working out who to leave behind. I find Gale the least memorable so far of the ones I've found so binned him off but even he was alright. In the Auntie Ethel quest mentioned above, I killed her and let the girl go with her zombie husband. Didn't even think about keeping him as a meatshield for myself but that's definitely happening next time when I play bastard, though know I will never be able to be mean to Scratch and the owlbear. Mostly bastard. |
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Post by dasbooter on Oct 27, 2023 10:49:03 GMT
How do you get to summon her husband ? There's a wand in the lair, just after the hag fight. It's basically a stick with some words inscribed. Grab that, and after you speak to the girl while she's trying to open the coffin you use it to cast a resurrection spell (at her insistence). She's.. not happy with the results so you can keep her husband as a pet :-D Google Connor Vinderblad for better instructions I have the same player character and squad by the way (although I do like to swap in everyone regularly) /highfive |
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Jumped back on quickly a bit later….
