wunty
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Post by wunty on Apr 3, 2024 14:26:00 GMT
Yeah. I haven't really got the patience any more. That's the one thing that's sort of putting me off the Elden Ring DLC. I'll happily go back and replay DS 1-3 as I know the bosses inside and out so don't mind messing about. New games though? Hmm. Lords of the Fallen tested my patience, as did Lies of P. I got through them but was acutely aware how little I enjoyed the bosses.
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Post by quadfather on Apr 3, 2024 14:29:32 GMT
Same. Which is why I replay the ones I can do over and over as I still get what I want out of the game -Fun.
That's why I don't buy much new stuff anymore
Roguelites, fuck off Hard bosses, fuck off Exploration, yes please Fun, very much so yes please Comedy, huge bonus
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Post by mothercruncher on Apr 3, 2024 15:29:28 GMT
Man, as an archer, finding I really like kicking people to death.
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Post by quadfather on Apr 3, 2024 15:34:26 GMT
I was fighting a saurian and it nearly speared me off a cliff. I ran and jumped past him, turned round and kicked him right in the face off the cliff.
£50 right there.
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Post by Danno on Apr 3, 2024 16:05:56 GMT
This is Harryhausen as fuck I love it
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Vortex
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Post by Vortex on Apr 3, 2024 16:07:08 GMT
This is Harryhausen as fuck I love it You're Harryhausen as fuck. Nice turn of phrase btw.
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Post by quadfather on Apr 3, 2024 16:07:52 GMT
Good analogy! Like it
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neems
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Post by neems on Apr 3, 2024 16:08:16 GMT
I must really be an outlier then, I love Radagon / Elden Beast. I reckon I've beaten them in co-op maybe 40 or 50 times.
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Frog
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Post by Frog on Apr 3, 2024 16:21:12 GMT
Elden beast was awful, game would have been better having Malenia sat there waiting to kill me for a day. It wasn't even hard, it was just bad.
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Post by JuniorFE on Apr 3, 2024 16:29:17 GMT
Can't say I agree with the general disdain for boss battles tbh. They can feel like a chore when done badly sometimes, Elden Beast being one easily improvable example even if I personally don't outright hate it (or when there's an overabundance of them)... But in general when there's a big climactic fight, especially against somebody that the story and/or background have built up as an important and/or powerful enemy, I'd much rather have control over said fight than watch them be taken care of in a cutscene (or God forbid off-screen...)
Imagine if the likes of Lu Bu, or Morgott, or Malenia, or Tokichiro, or [insert JRPG final boss here], or any number of other bosses I could mention, were nothing but a big cutscene fight and you just watch. Could it still be cinematic and cool af? Sure! But we're talking about videogames here, not movies or TV series, and wanting less interactivity and gameplay in your big moments in a medium that's usually all about the player not being a passive observer... I dunno, feels like kind of an oxymoron to me 😅
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Post by Trowel 🏴 on Apr 3, 2024 16:37:48 GMT
That's where Super Metroid got it so right with the final boss - it was no longer about the challenge, it was about completing your story. I can only think of one other game that took a similar approach, which was very recently in Prince of Persia .
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Frog
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Post by Frog on Apr 3, 2024 17:17:30 GMT
Lu Bu is another shit tier boss fight as well. Would rather watch a cut scene than fight him 😂
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Ulythium
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Post by Ulythium on Apr 3, 2024 17:37:02 GMT
Lu Bu is another shit tier boss fight as well. Would rather watch a cut scene than fight him 😂
Wo Long, or Dynasty Warriors?
I've never played any of the musou games, but I loved the Lu Bu fight in Wo Long.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2024 17:40:26 GMT
Lu Bu has always been a pain in the ass (a good one) in Musou. “IT’S LU BU!!” became a meme early on because he always arrives and fucks your shit up.
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Post by quadfather on Apr 3, 2024 17:49:55 GMT
Can't say I agree with the general disdain for boss battles tbh. They can feel like a chore when done badly sometimes, Elden Beast being one easily improvable example even if I personally don't outright hate it (or when there's an overabundance of them)... But in general when there's a big climactic fight, especially against somebody that the story and/or background have built up as an important and/or powerful enemy, I'd much rather have control over said fight than watch them be taken care of in a cutscene (or God forbid off-screen...) Imagine if the likes of Lu Bu, or Morgott, or Malenia, or Tokichiro, or [insert JRPG final boss here], or any number of other bosses I could mention, were nothing but a big cutscene fight and you just watch. Could it still be cinematic and cool af? Sure! But we're talking about videogames here, not movies or TV series, and wanting less interactivity and gameplay in your big moments in a medium that's usually all about the player not being a passive observer... I dunno, feels like kind of an oxymoron to me 😅 I agree with this, but the fun just simply *stops* when you realise if you make a couple, or even just one mistake and it's game over. Yeah, I can learn the mechanics of what the boss is going to do next etc, but in the same vein I could also learn about being an estate agent. It. Isn't. Fun. When. It's. That. Brutal. So take some bullshit boss in elden ring for example. And now compare that to a minotaur in dd2. It doesn't even compare, because capcom don't want you to get completely fucked off forever until you learn how to be an estate agent. Which, to be fair, I'd probably rather learn than a bosses moveset. I'd rather have the dd approach where there is more chaos involves with multiple characters going for it. There is no way you can script that, and that's exactly the beauty of the game. It's practically alive. I think thats why I don't like "get gud bosses". Fuck that crap.
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robthehermit
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Post by robthehermit on Apr 3, 2024 17:56:24 GMT
Back on topic with my handy tip of the day. Running low on Wakestones? Get yourself to the nearest rift, search for level one pawns, hire a couple and rest up for 24 hours. Get two shards. Rinse and repeat.
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RobEG
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Post by RobEG on Apr 3, 2024 18:07:46 GMT
You tell ‘em quad To be fair, junior is a young whipper snapper. He hasn’t been ravaged by time like us old folk
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robthehermit
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Post by robthehermit on Apr 3, 2024 18:12:03 GMT
Yeah, once the arthritis kicks in he'll soon change his tune.
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wunty
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Post by wunty on Apr 3, 2024 18:18:58 GMT
Not to mention the drop in reflexes that us old gits suffer from. By the time I realise what’s going on I’m already dead half the time.
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Post by JuniorFE on Apr 3, 2024 19:34:52 GMT
quadfather (and anyone else) a boss being unfairly strong or cheap (to the point of "one mistake and you're done") falls under the "done badly" bit Lu Bu is strong, and there's no real substitute to "git gudness" for him (well, Ominous Chill, but...), but you can take enough hits to learn the fight and progress, and he doesn't pull out any unexpected bullshit at the halfway point or anything. Malenia is similar, sure you're not tanking a full Waterfowl to the face but she's not gonna blink-and-you're-dead (not to mention there's ways to make her almost easy, including the DD approach with multiple characters, a Mimic Tear in particular can double up your strat and shred her if you're even decently ready) and so on. Undoubtedly, there's also stinkers like Godskin Duo (the Souls games don't really lend themselves to gank squad boss fights, and these guys in particular feel like they were designed to be battled separately, then tossed at you together just because), Elden Beast with its constant exhausting movement (easily fixable if they just let you ride Torrent like in Fire Giant) and, speaking of, Fire Giant with his bouncing fire breath and rolling... Or, to step away from Elden Ring, Yuan Shu from the Wo Long DLC (a boss that feels designed to spit on the vast majority of strategies the rest of the game was fine with), Yatsu-no-Kami and Umi-bozu in Nioh (both not overly bad, but tossed at you far too early when you'll get frustrated dealing with them)... But the thing is, I find them to be exceptions, not the rule. There are bosses that even I find frustrating, youthful reflexes and all (laugh track here, I'm adaptable, not good ), bosses that I feel happy to defeat not because "fucking hell, that was great" but because "fucking hell, this guy sucked"... But again, I just can't agree that that makes all bosses suck
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Ulythium
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Post by Ulythium on Apr 3, 2024 19:42:29 GMT
I totally understand why someone might find the prospect of fighting, say, Fume Knight 20-30 times in a row to be a complete pain in the tits. I really do.
I loved every last second of it, though.
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wunty
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Post by wunty on Apr 3, 2024 20:01:26 GMT
Ha. Been there with Fume Knight. That and Midir were the kinds of bosses I used to just make myself comfortable for. Three hours solid for Midir one evening. That’s a LOT of goes. Now though? Yeah fuck that.
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Chopsen
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Post by Chopsen on Apr 3, 2024 20:25:35 GMT
Wait. People actually finish games they play? Seriously?
We've had the boss battles are shit argument on here before. No need to rehash: they are.
Life's too short frankly and agree that I have absolutely no interest in being an estate agent.
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Post by starchildhypocrethes on Apr 3, 2024 20:41:35 GMT
Just to add my correct opinion to the discussion as well; boss fights suck. All of them.
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wunty
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Post by wunty on Apr 3, 2024 20:45:33 GMT
Erm Rob… Wodewick just threw one of my other pawns off a cliff.
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Post by JuniorFE on Apr 3, 2024 20:46:43 GMT
Boss battles suck, finishing games sucks... Starting to sound like it's old age that sucks more than anything, tbh
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wunty
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Post by wunty on Apr 3, 2024 20:55:13 GMT
Oh god. The orb quest ended badly. A few people are dead.
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Post by quadfather on Apr 3, 2024 21:16:00 GMT
quadfather (and anyone else) a boss being unfairly strong or cheap (to the point of "one mistake and you're done") falls under the "done badly" bit Lu Bu is strong, and there's no real substitute to "git gudness" for him (well, Ominous Chill, but...), but you can take enough hits to learn the fight and progress, and he doesn't pull out any unexpected bullshit at the halfway point or anything. Malenia is similar, sure you're not tanking a full Waterfowl to the face but she's not gonna blink-and-you're-dead (not to mention there's ways to make her almost easy, including the DD approach with multiple characters, a Mimic Tear in particular can double up your strat and shred her if you're even decently ready) and so on. Undoubtedly, there's also stinkers like Godskin Duo (the Souls games don't really lend themselves to gank squad boss fights, and these guys in particular feel like they were designed to be battled separately, then tossed at you together just because), Elden Beast with its constant exhausting movement (easily fixable if they just let you ride Torrent like in Fire Giant) and, speaking of, Fire Giant with his bouncing fire breath and rolling... Or, to step away from Elden Ring, Yuan Shu from the Wo Long DLC (a boss that feels designed to spit on the vast majority of strategies the rest of the game was fine with), Yatsu-no-Kami and Umi-bozu in Nioh (both not overly bad, but tossed at you far too early when you'll get frustrated dealing with them)... But the thing is, I find them to be exceptions, not the rule. There are bosses that even I find frustrating, youthful reflexes and all (laugh track here, I'm adaptable, not good ), bosses that I feel happy to defeat not because "fucking hell, that was great" but because "fucking hell, this guy sucked"... But again, I just can't agree that that makes all bosses suck Absolutely agree, and I totally get what you're saying. But the difference is, if someone had told me the same to me (as I just did to you), I'd be more on about praising the game, as opposed to trying to defend it. That, basically, tells me all I need to know about the game. But I'm an old git and I know what I like. You have much more spunk in you that I have (oo-er), and it takes time to settle. I love the fact you relish it. It reminds me of the same thing. I've just changed over the years and know what I like (see old git comment above l ) I like these chats though, they're cathartic to an old gamer
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Ulythium
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Post by Ulythium on Apr 3, 2024 21:16:16 GMT
Looking at where I am in DD2, and comparing it to FightinCowboy's 'Let's play' playlist, it seems I'm well into the main questline. Reckon I'll ease off for a bit and do some exploring/side content, as I don't want this game to end anytime soon.
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Post by quadfather on Apr 3, 2024 21:22:16 GMT
Oh god. The orb quest ended badly. A few people are dead. I'm starting to think that I need to pay more attention as the bodies seem to be piling up
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