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Post by GigaChad Sigma. on Mar 16, 2022 15:46:56 GMT
I'm pretty resigned to the fact I wont be retiring until my late 60's possibly 70's or dead.
They'll be no Saga holiday swingers parties for me.
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Post by Zomoniac on Mar 16, 2022 16:24:10 GMT
The same people who say anyone can buy a Lambo, it's the maintenance costs that will kill you. If you can't stretch to a Lambo, Ferraris are completely affordable. Just get a second hand one, they lose a third of their value straight away. www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202202122459463Oh. |
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dogbot
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Post by dogbot on Mar 16, 2022 16:26:09 GMT
ULEZ compliant, though...
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anephric
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The first 6 I took out with a whirlwind kick
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Post by anephric on Mar 16, 2022 17:05:48 GMT
My 68 plate Qashqai will knock quite a bit off that price in trade-in.
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anephric
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Post by anephric on Mar 16, 2022 17:07:09 GMT
I saw two Ferraris and a Lambo in a big dick energy posse the other day. I can't imagine driving those kinds of cars on the roads around here, it must be fucking excruciating. I just don't see the point as an everyday car on UK roads unless you really need people to take in your BDE.
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Post by spacein_vader on Mar 16, 2022 17:08:16 GMT
This is insane. Not that you offered, that you know how much of a raise you have them. I understand why companies ask how much you currently earn but I don't understand why anyone tells them. Why on earth would I give away my biggest bargaining chip? I bet when your company asks for tenders for a (for example,) printing contract, it doesn't tell the bidders what they pay the current supplier. There's two elements. One we are a heavily regulated industry so all of our recruitment processes are open to Audit from the regulators. So we work to specific salary levels. Secondly in any organisation it's something I'll ask for on the first call. Most organisations have specific salary bands there's no point in either of wasting our time if are not on the same page. I'm not going to lowball people but at the same time I'm not going to hire someone way above market rate or as an outlier to the existing team. My previous company would ask for a proof of existing salary as part of vetting so unless you can evidence a counter or upcoming promotion it's better to have that conversation up front. I agree there's no point if you're not on the same page, but presumably your ad has a salary banding? If so I'd not apply if my expectation was outside that banding. If you're banding is 40-50k then it'll be within your existing team range I'd assume, so why would it matter if my current role pays 39k or 22? Glad I've never worked in an industry that needs to know what I used to earn for vetting. I'm not even sure how that would help any potential vetting. All it would prove is I'm not a liar, and there are plenty of other facts you could ask for that would prove that. |
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Post by Aunt Alison on Mar 16, 2022 17:14:48 GMT
I saw two Ferraris and a Lambo in a big dick energy posse the other day. I can't imagine driving those kinds of cars on the roads around here, it must be fucking excruciating. I just don't see the point as an everyday car on UK roads unless you really need people to take in your BDE. Isn't that the opposite of BDE? |
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anephric
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Post by anephric on Mar 16, 2022 17:20:57 GMT
I may be misunderstanding BDE.
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Post by Aunt Alison on Mar 16, 2022 17:30:11 GMT
Isn't it being confident without looking like you're showing off?
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Post by Aunt Alison on Mar 16, 2022 17:30:41 GMT
That sounds more like the Tiny Penis Convoy
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2022 17:32:41 GMT
overcompensating etc
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Post by technoish on Mar 16, 2022 18:59:31 GMT
Our bands as advertised in job ads are really annoying. They go up quite high for the really old guard who either used to get annual progression pay increases, or who came in from another government department.
So successful candidates expect being able to negotiate up to the top (they are usually taking a pay cut anyway to join). But basically anybody joining is only offered the minimum, there isn't really a negotiation possible any more. You can director approval to go higher but it has to be a fairly good reason. When I recruit externally usually get 30+ applicants. Admittedly most of them are actually awful.
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zagibu
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Post by zagibu on Mar 16, 2022 23:53:04 GMT
Our bands as advertised in job ads are really annoying. They go up quite high for the really old guard who either used to get annual progression pay increases, or who came in from another government department. So successful candidates expect being able to negotiate up to the top (they are usually taking a pay cut anyway to join). But basically anybody joining is only offered the minimum, there isn't really a negotiation possible any more. You can director approval to go higher but it has to be a fairly good reason. When I recruit externally usually get 30+ applicants. Admittedly most of them are actually awful. It seems the problem is that you are advertising different pay bands than you are really able to offer. You should talk with the guy who puts up the job offers about that. |
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Post by Bill in the rain on Mar 17, 2022 2:34:10 GMT
I was always told to *never* answer about how much you're currently getting paid, or even about what your pay expectations are in the first few rounds of interviews.
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Lizard
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Post by Lizard on Mar 17, 2022 4:33:16 GMT
Whenever I get asked about pay I grab the interviewer's bollocks, give them a squeeze and say 'I get paid what I want, sunshine'. Never fails.
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dogbot
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Post by dogbot on Mar 17, 2022 10:55:01 GMT
I've noticed a change in tactics from recruiters this time around. Usually, in the past, they've told me what salary bands are going to be. This time, I've either had to ask outright (which has often caused waffling or outright refusal to answer), or more commonly they have asked me what I want.
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robthehermit
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Post by robthehermit on Mar 17, 2022 10:57:39 GMT
I'm pretty resigned to the fact I wont be retiring until my late 60's possibly 70's or dead. Given that the retirement age is rising to 67 in a few years, that's highly likely. I'm not expecting to make it either. |
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Post by snackplissken on Mar 17, 2022 11:09:26 GMT
I've noticed a change in tactics from recruiters this time around. Usually, in the past, they've told me what salary bands are going to be. This time, I've either had to ask outright (which has often caused waffling or outright refusal to answer), or more commonly they have asked me what I want. Yeah I've asked a few times and they were adamant that I needed to send an updated CV and have a phone call before even getting to know what the salary was. Seems like a complete waste of time if it's nowhere near what I'm on... |
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Bongo Heracles
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Post by Bongo Heracles on Mar 17, 2022 11:18:33 GMT
Ive had that a few times recently, especially asking for 'informal chats' before any real details are offered. Im pretty happy in my job and it would take a money hat to shift me so if you hit me up on linked in offering me a superb opportunity and then act cagey about the details, you can obviously go fuck yourself.
One guy absolutely couldnt understand why I wouldnt update and send him my CV in exchange for the job description of the actual position he was contacting me about.
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Post by GigaChad Sigma. on Mar 17, 2022 12:01:50 GMT
There is an art to being open with remuneration and not setting unrealistic expectations.
An official salary band might be 60 - 80k tell that to a candidate and all they'll hear is the 80k.
In reality that band might be applied over different teams and departments with different skills etc. If you're a software developer with fortran and pascal you're not going to be getting the same offers as one with Java and Python.
Or you might be joining a team where there is no one on more than £65k so that's going to be part of the equation.
There's an assumption that offers are plucked out of the air when in reality there's a whole benchmarking and approval process.
So unless you have a job that pays £70,342.87 exactly and its uniform for all the existing staff there's always going to be a bit of ambiguity around figures.
TLDR.
A recruiter will ask for your current salary and package (matron) because it saves everyone time. If you don't want to give me your salary or your expectations that's fine but unless you're the only person in the world who can do the job that's where the conversation ends.
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Bongo Heracles
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Post by Bongo Heracles on Mar 17, 2022 12:06:34 GMT
An official salary band might be 60 - 80k tell that to a candidate and all they'll hear is the 80k. You'd know better than me but I would assume that in most instances that would lead to the majority of people pitching at 70. I'd be at the 'Im good but Im not top of the band good' guy. And, yeah, we never hire at the top of the band because it leaves no room for development and the candidate immediately hits the 'no pay rise for you, bro' buffer. |
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Post by GigaChad Sigma. on Mar 17, 2022 12:07:56 GMT
Also the worst trend I have seen are CV's with sections with fucking skills where people rank themselves
Teamwork *****
Problem solving *****
Leadership ****
Communication *****
Oooooh a five in problem solving that's the person we need!
Give me facts.
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dogbot
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Post by dogbot on Mar 17, 2022 12:08:53 GMT
There is an art to being open with remuneration and not setting unrealistic expectations. An official salary band might be 60 - 80k tell that to a candidate and all they'll hear is the 80k. In reality that band might be applied over different teams and departments with different skills etc. If you're a software developer with fortran and pascal you're not going to be getting the same offers as one with Java and Python. Or you might be joining a team where there is no one on more than £65k so that's going to be part of the equation. There's an assumption that offers are plucked out of the air when in reality there's a whole benchmarking and approval process. So unless you have a job that pays £70,342.87 exactly and its uniform for all the existing staff there's always going to be a bit of ambiguity around figures. TLDR. A recruiter will ask for your current salary and package (matron) because it saves everyone time. If you don't want to give me your salary or your expectations that's fine but unless you're the only person in the world who can do the job that's where the conversation ends. That's fine. But don't expect people who are on £70k currently to be remotely interested in a sideways move for £65k (or less) because of company structure. That's your problem, not theirs (especially if current market rates are more) and it's not remotely realistic and will also be where the conversation ends.  |
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Post by GigaChad Sigma. on Mar 17, 2022 12:13:52 GMT
100%.
I have conversations regularly with hiring managers where I explain their absurd expectations are wasting everyone's time.
No the Head of Marketing for Google doesn't want to take a pay cut to take this job 20 miles from his home.
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Bongo Heracles
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Post by Bongo Heracles on Mar 17, 2022 12:19:54 GMT
I do wonder what goes through peoples heads sometimes. I have a colleague that puts out ads with a laundry list of requirements for junior staff that I would think was a bit much for my mid-tier guys and he wonders why condidates always pull out when pay comes up.
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Post by darkling on Mar 17, 2022 12:28:09 GMT
"Nobody dies regretting not working hard enough" is a phrase echoing around my head a lot recently, especially as I've been working well into the evenings over the last 2 weeks to meet deadlines.
Given I likely won't be getting a retirement, my long-held belief that people in society are being coerced into higher levels of competition seems more true than ever.
We should be allowing natural evolution of technology to alleviate the necessity to work, yet the ownership of said technology is merely being used to cut staff, rather than reduce their hours.
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dogbot
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Post by dogbot on Mar 17, 2022 12:30:31 GMT
I do wonder what goes through peoples heads sometimes. I have a colleague that puts out ads with a laundry list of requirements for junior staff that I would think was a bit much for my mid-tier guys and he wonders why condidates always pull out when pay comes up. This is exactly what my current (soon to be ex-  ) employer is doing. Massive requirements, salary offers that are 5 years out of date, can't understand why there's no applicants. |
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sport✅
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Post by sport✅ on Mar 17, 2022 14:17:38 GMT
Looks like P&O Ferries have played a blinder. Sack all staff and have a coach of agency workers waiting to board.
Sounds very much like Honk's doing.
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Post by GigaChad Sigma. on Mar 17, 2022 14:39:48 GMT
I was heavily engaged in the strategy.
It was my idea to have the security staff wear balaclavas when they forced the staff off the ferries as I thought it would be safer for everyone.
I can't take credit for the great idea to fire everybody by Zoom and terminate their employment immediately after the call.
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Post by brokenkey on Mar 17, 2022 15:16:24 GMT
"Nobody dies regretting not working hard enough" is a phrase echoing around my head a lot recently, especially as I've been working well into the evenings over the last 2 weeks to meet deadlines. I bet if you were a drowning lifeguard, you might disagree. |
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) employer is doing.