MolarAm🔵
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Post by MolarAm🔵 on Jul 22, 2024 4:21:44 GMT
She's a former prosecutor.
Like obviously it's not a slam dunk. But if anyone is going to do well dismantling a debate opponent, it's going to be a former prosecutor.
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Post by Bill the kidding on Jul 22, 2024 4:25:41 GMT
She didn't do that great in the debates when she was running for the Democratic nomination last time though, did she? And Trump has this weird thing where he always seems to come out of every debate untouched, no matter what his opponents say or what crap he spouts.
But fingers crossed!
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lukasz
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Post by lukasz on Jul 22, 2024 4:32:37 GMT
She didn't do that great in the debates when she was running for the Democratic nomination last time though, did she? And Trump has this weird thing where he always seems to come out of every debate untouched, no matter what his opponents say or what crap he spouts. But fingers crossed! She did poorly from what I quickly read. Not even serious candidate for president. I do wonder, complete speculation, whether she tried to play too timid. Angry black woman is a meme itself. Do wonder how will trump respond in debate. I think he said that she will be easier opponent to beat than biden
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Post by JuniorFE on Jul 22, 2024 4:32:38 GMT
She didn't do that great in the debates when she was running for the Democratic nomination last time though, did she? And Trump has this weird thing where he always seems to come out of every debate untouched, no matter what his opponents say or what crap he spouts. But fingers crossed! That was four years ago. Her speech accepting the endorsement yesterday was already seen as a big improvement and we've all seen how much can change in four years. And yeah, Trump's called the Teflon Don for a reason, but right now that's mostly to his base. The rub is energizing Democrats (which she seems to have done) and bringing in the non-cultists.
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MolarAm🔵
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Post by MolarAm🔵 on Jul 22, 2024 5:17:37 GMT
Also, as a former prosecutor, imo she's pretty well placed to be running against an outright criminal.
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X201
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Post by X201 on Jul 22, 2024 5:55:08 GMT
Plus they can play the old white guy again card and also point out that Trump will be older than Biden before his term in office ends.
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Post by JuniorFE on Jul 22, 2024 5:56:21 GMT
Incidentally, Harris has raised $73,266,921 so far (last I checked here under the "week" of 21/07)... from grassroots donations alone, i.e. the public throwing in their fivers and tenners and $25s etc. Bit of excitement happening, it would seem!
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Post by Bill the kidding on Jul 22, 2024 6:13:06 GMT
Yeah. Hopefully that translates into something. And since US elections seem to often be determined by money, it can't hurt.
Though in many ways it doesn't matter that much how excited Dems are about her, in the same way it doesn't matter how Trump voters feel about her. It's all going to come down to those few battleground states and the swing voters there.
But if she can energize voters and get more young and dem voters out then that's only a good thing. She might benefit in some areas from not being as tied to the Gaza issue as Biden. Getting those younger voters out in numbers is always an issue the left seems to have.
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mcmonkeyplc
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Post by mcmonkeyplc on Jul 22, 2024 6:58:12 GMT
According to the Economist it's best if the Dems actually have a process for the nomination and Harris has to win against someone to energise the Base.
I'd agree better to have an actual competition as a dry run for competing against the orange earless cunt than a coronation.
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Post by Vandelay on Jul 22, 2024 7:17:00 GMT
Not paid much attention to him for some time now, but I see Owen Jones has gone fully unhinged. He posted a YouTube video last night entitled "Biden to stand down - History will damn him!" and the image has the subtle caption "GOODBYE TO A MONSTER".
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Post by drhickman1983 on Jul 22, 2024 7:25:14 GMT
Fuck Owen Jones and his fucking stupid purity tests
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Post by JuniorFE on Jul 22, 2024 7:38:38 GMT
According to the Economist it's best if the Dems actually have a process for the nomination and Harris has to win against someone to energise the Base. I'd agree better to have an actual competition as a dry run for competing against the orange earless cunt than a coronation. She's been endorsed by all 50 democratic state chairs, plus AOC and the Squad, the public (as far as donations are concerned), Biden himself and her most probable competition Newsom and Whitmer... And she was already VP, so she's hardly someone unelected that's randomly being pushed. Somehow I doubt it's happening. Aside from reintroducing the "discord" talking points, there's also not much point in a competition where the only contender is Harris herself anyway...
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baihu1983
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Post by baihu1983 on Jul 22, 2024 7:40:37 GMT
She'll smoke him in any debate and actual fact check the twats lies.
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Post by skalpadda on Jul 22, 2024 8:00:29 GMT
Yeah, getting enough of their own side to actually vote is the only path I see to a Dem win. Unless something truly dramatic happens, but I can't imagine anything turning the cult away from Trump at this point. Even if he suddenly died I'm pretty sure they'd just pretend it didn't happen, cheerfully strap his corpse to a golden throne toilet in the oval office and start performing daily sacrifices of psykers EPA workers to their God-Emperor.
The US' pathetic 50-60% turnout makes non-voters the biggest block by far. Convincing a few thousand to actually vote in swing states can't be completely impossible. Then again, the Democrats seem to have an infinite supply of self-sabotage, so I refuse to get my hopes up.
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Post by Bill the kidding on Jul 22, 2024 8:07:05 GMT
According to the Economist it's best if the Dems actually have a process for the nomination and Harris has to win against someone to energise the Base. I'd agree better to have an actual competition as a dry run for competing against the orange earless cunt than a coronation. She's been endorsed by all 50 democratic state chairs, plus AOC and the Squad, the public (as far as donations are concerned), Biden himself and her most probable competition Newsom and Whitmer... And she was already VP, so she's hardly someone unelected that's randomly being pushed. Somehow I doubt it's happening. Aside from reintroducing the "discord" talking points, there's also not much point in a competition where the only contender is Harris herself anyway... My initial reaction was that they should have some kind of competitive process, if only to get the news cycles. But at this point, with almost everyone endorsing her, it seems like it'd be going backwards, and involve a reasonable risk of self sabotage by airing attack lines. Then again, Trump's side will probably air those attack lines anyway.
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Post by jeepers on Jul 22, 2024 8:11:19 GMT
Some journo made a good point: Where was the succession planning for their 81 (or whatever) year old leader?
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zephro
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Post by zephro on Jul 22, 2024 8:41:52 GMT
Fuck Owen Jones and his fucking stupid purity tests The Guardian really needs to sack him off, and Jenkins.
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drakesmoke
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Post by drakesmoke on Jul 22, 2024 8:47:00 GMT
She'll smoke him in any debate and actual fact check the twats lies. It took me a lot to play Jeremy Vine but now I have hope.
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Post by Whizzo on Jul 22, 2024 8:49:18 GMT
I have never thought I'd want asparagus to have a correct opinion.
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Post by Duffking on Jul 22, 2024 9:00:33 GMT
We're in a click based economy and Jones gets a lot of rage clicks for the Guardian, they're not gonna bin him.
Biden was terrible to be fair, not least because of feebly enabling what is basically a genocide and the erosion of abortion rights happening under his watch.
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Post by Reviewer on Jul 22, 2024 9:32:24 GMT
Not sure he can be blamed for the abortion rights one.
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Post by drhickman1983 on Jul 22, 2024 9:34:25 GMT
Okay sure, but he was still looking far better than the alternatives.
Especially with the VP pick anyone who thinks Palestine and Abortion rights will be better off under Trump is a bit short sighted.
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Post by JuniorFE on Jul 22, 2024 9:36:41 GMT
Bit unfair to say that IMO. He inherited a SCOTUS stacked against him and accountable to no one but themselves, a hostile Senate for half of his term and hostile House for the other half, lower courts also ready to obstruct him (as they did only last week, blocking his student debt relief), a pandemic in full swing and a chaotic retreat from Afghanistan orchestrated and initiated by Trump that he had no choice but to finish, plus the war in Ukraine...
And yet he still managed to push through pandemic aid, infrastructure bills, manufacturing bills and debt relief, among others, numbering in the trillions of dollars, that quite literally saved lives in some cases, have far reaching effects that should be felt in the next years (assuming a Trump doesn't wreck them) and left the US handling inflation better than most nations.
Could he have done more? Perhaps (although stopping a SCOTUS that regularly wiped its collective arse with precedent and the Constitution would be almost impossible for any president). But to openly say a president already being hailed as one of the most, if not the most, progressive in decades was "terrible", especially after Trump...
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Ulythium
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Post by Ulythium on Jul 22, 2024 9:39:02 GMT
Yeah, I don't agree with that take on Biden *at all*.
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Post by Duffking on Jul 22, 2024 10:02:06 GMT
The SCOTUS is one thing but they knew it was coming and they didn't even *try* to do anything about it by codifying it into law. And in general, regardless of what the rest of your record looks like, if you directly enable a genocide you are pretty terrible.
Regardless, Harris has a better chance than Biden at keeping Trump out, though hopefully she's improved as a candidate since her last attempt which was pretty dire.
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Post by JuniorFE on Jul 22, 2024 10:23:51 GMT
So the US has had terrible presidents since basically post-WW2 when the alliance with Israel began then, got it. /s
Look, I don't condone Israel's actions, but the fact remains that it's the US' only ally in the Middle East besides maybe Egypt, a foothold in a very volatile region and has historically been a counterweight against Russia. Unilaterally and completely withdrawing support (and honestly, the Biden admin has already been one of the least supportive in recent times) would destabilize the Middle East even further, give Russia more power (perhaps both of these at the same time, given that Israel would most likely look elsewhere for support in the war, and who better than the opportunistic enemy of their erstwhile ally?), give Republicans even more ammo ("They abandoned our ally!!1!11!") and in general have unpredictable effects on the world stage, effects that couldn't be risked with the US itself being so volatile at the moment.
The geopolitical situation in the Middle East goes far beyond what you or I can fully comprehend. The volatility would never end with the Biden admin (even though, again, steps have been taken to reduce support as the situation deteriorated), and to dismiss his entire tenure as terrible because of this one bad and yet incredibly complicated and delicate situation is very short-sighted, especially with a Trump in sight ready to do far worse and eventually "build resorts in the bombed-out Gaza strip" (ask Kushner)
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Post by skalpadda on Jul 22, 2024 10:27:08 GMT
Duffking Congress writes new laws, not the president. Have they held both houses at all under Biden? I also wish the US would stop propping up Israel no matter what they do, but there are political realities there that don't start or stop at Biden. He has at least consistently argued for ceasefire and negotiations. Every US president is going to do things that are bad or even evil. You can argue that makes every US president bad and evil, but within the context I don't think it's fair at all to call him terrible.
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Tuffty
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Post by Tuffty on Jul 22, 2024 10:27:34 GMT
We can all have our thoughts on Biden supporting Israel to the extent he has and feel aggrieved by it and even be validated for it. But fuck me, do you really think Trump would be any better?
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Post by Duffking on Jul 22, 2024 10:33:20 GMT
I appreciate Israel's political importance to the USA, but if you can't provide even a little bit of forceful pushback in the "hey maybe stop killing so many civillians" department it's pretty damn bad.
Abortion would have been a tough fight, but the vibe was basically "we've tried literally fuck all and we're all out of ideas". Maybe it would have been futile, but fuck, at least *try* and do something with the system.
Frankly their system is even more shit than ours though, it's crazy that a bunch of 9 unelected, broadly elderly partisans are who really run that country by "interpreting" what some people 200+ years ago might have thought about something if they were as much of a twat as they were.
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Post by Duffking on Jul 22, 2024 10:34:49 GMT
We can all have our thoughts on Biden supporting Israel to the extent he has and feel aggrieved by it and even be validated for it. But fuck me, do you really think Trump would be any better? I cannot comprehend how on earth you've read any of my posts which state "I can understand why someone might think Biden was shit" and arrived at "this user thinks Trump would be better". Honestly an incredibly bizarre post if your thought process of seeing someone disapprove of a candidate on x/y grounds is to immediately assume that they think someone who is even worse on those same grounds would somehow be better.
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