|
|
Post by RadicalRex on Sept 14, 2021 13:17:31 GMT
I always find interesting that people say how hard Hollow Knight is. May have to do with expectations. For a metroidvania, I think it is unusually heavy on fast-paced, skill-based precision action platforming. At least in the medium to hard boss battles you need to memorise their patterns, be quick and precise and have a good rhythm. There's not a lot of room for error because your health is (and remains) pretty limited. Contrast to games like Super Metroid, SotN or Axiom Verge which are much less skill-based and most enemies move pretty slowly/are less aggressive. I like that it does this, but it was a little unexpected. Setting and tone seemed atmosphere- and lore-heavy to me and I expected it to be a slower, more relaxed experience than it actually is. From my early experiences in the game I certainly did not expect to find something like the White Castle here. I know that part is (thankfully!) optional, but just the fact that it's there shows that the game wants to give you a tougher challenge than what you're used to from most metroidvanias. |
|
|
|
Post by Vandelay on Sept 14, 2021 13:25:37 GMT
I always find interesting that people say how hard Hollow Knight is. May have to do with expectations. For a metroidvania, I think it is unusually heavy on fast-paced, skill-based precision action platforming. At least in the medium to hard boss battles you need to memorise their patterns, be quick and precise and have a good rhythm. There's not a lot of room for error because your health is (and remains) pretty limited. Contrast to games like Super Metroid, SotN or Axiom Verge which are much less skill-based and most enemies move pretty slowly/are less aggressive. I like that it does this, but it was a little unexpected. Setting and tone seemed atmosphere- and lore-heavy to me and I expected it to be a slower, more relaxed experience than it actually is. From my early experiences in the game I certainly did not expect to find something like the White Castle here. I know that part is (thankfully!) optional, but just the fact that it's there shows that the game wants to give you a tougher challenge than what you're used to from most metroidvanias. This is a very good point. I did come into it more with the expectations of it being a 2D Souls-like than Metroidvania. I also generally play Souls games as a dodging character than one focused on blocking, so I naturally went for an attack, dodge, keep distance, attack, dodge... rhythm. The White Palace was intense. The final screen of the Path of Pain must have taken me almost a 3 figure number of attempts |
|
|
|
Post by RadicalRex on Sept 14, 2021 13:30:50 GMT
White Castle is excruciating, I hadn't hated a game this much since Mass Effect 3. I also just recalled that I was looking for mods and it seemed like 80% of them were about making the game easier.
|
|
MolarAm🔵
Full Member
Bad at games
Posts: 6,840
|
Post by MolarAm🔵 on Sept 14, 2021 13:43:04 GMT
White Castle is excruciating, I hadn't hated a game this much since Mass Effect 3. I also just recalled that I was looking for mods and it seemed like 80% of them were about making the game easier. Yeah, that was the thing that soured me. I'm fine with the developers making you play Hollow Meat Boy for bragging rights or whatever. But to make you do it for the Real Ending is, imo, a bad decision. I know some people like that kind of challenge, but that's not the thing that drew me to this game. And it sucks that I don't get to really finish it. |
|
|
|
Post by Aunt Alison on Sept 14, 2021 13:45:13 GMT
How many endings are there? I did the nasty platforming section used the dream nail on the hollow knight and beat the Radiance , is that the best ending? It's the only one I've seen There are 5 endings, with a bonus post credit ending if you complete a particular side quest. Killing the Hollow Knight without the Voidheart is the most straightforward and the one I would expect first time players to get . I think the one you describe is the longest one and involves doing the most. The two endings added in the last DLC involve killing all the bosses in the Pantheon . Not done it, but I assume you can do that in a more straightforward way than the Voidheart ending, but it will be harder. Thanks for that. I assumed it was the best ending. Is the platforming section necessary? I found it completely by accident (I don't know if there's any hint in the game about it). That section was so difficult - there were several times I wondered if it was just beyond me. Glad I stuck it out though. Loved the ending I got
Is the Pantheon a place I just hadn't found or is it the various optional bosses you find throughout the game?
I'm currently playing through it again and quite far in. Didn't do the DLC last time so looking forward to that
|
|
|
|
Post by Aunt Alison on Sept 14, 2021 13:53:42 GMT
White Castle is excruciating, I hadn't hated a game this much since Mass Effect 3. I also just recalled that I was looking for mods and it seemed like 80% of them were about making the game easier. Yeah, that was the thing that soured me. I'm fine with the developers making you play Hollow Meat Boy for bragging rights or whatever. But to make you do it for the Real Ending is, imo, a bad decision. I know some people like that kind of challenge, but that's not the thing that drew me to this game. And it sucks that I don't get to really finish it. So you do have to do it then. I suppose I'm lucky that I found it while I was still in love with the game so I was down for it. Imagine I might have felt different if I'd got a bad ending and had to go back and do that after I'd already finished just to see the proper ending. Final final boss was pretty hard as well. Satisfying though
I don't think Hollow Knight is a traditional metroidvania for the reasons given above
|
|
|
|
Post by Vandelay on Sept 14, 2021 14:53:02 GMT
Are we talking Path of Pain or the White Palace? Path of Pain is a completely optional hidden area in the White Palace. There is no need to do it for anything but bragging rights. Don't even think you get anything fancy for doing it. You would know if you found it, as its name would pop up when you enter. You do have to do the White Palace for the "proper" ending. Personally, I didn't think the White Palace was that bad. The Path of Pain was hellish though. The Pantheon is a hidden area added in one of the DLCs. It is really just a place to re-fight bosses and to fight harder versions of them. I'm not really sure how the endings there work, as I've not done it, but it sounds like you fight Absolute Radiance after going through the other bosses and that will give you a different ending. |
|
|
|
Post by Aunt Alison on Sept 14, 2021 14:58:22 GMT
Are we talking Path of Pain or the White Palace? Path of Pain is a completely optional hidden area in the White Palace. There is no need to do it for anything but bragging rights. Don't even think you get anything fancy for doing it. You would know if you found it, as its name would pop up when you enter. You do have to do the White Palace for the "proper" ending. Personally, I didn't think the White Palace was that bad. The Path of Pain was hellish though. The Pantheon is a hidden area added in one of the DLCs. It is really just a place to re-fight bosses and to fight harder versions of them. I'm not really sure how the endings there work, as I've not done it, but it sounds like you fight Absolute Radiance after going through the other bosses and that will give you a different ending. Ah yeah, that's what confused me when I heard people talking about the White Palace/Path of Pain. I thought they were the same thing. I did the Path of Pain as well then. Think I just hit a random wall and it turned out to be a secret. That was the bit I struggled with! All those buzzsaws and you had to do each section perfectly start to finish. Nightmare
/brags
|
|
idgaf
New Member
Posts: 265
|
Post by idgaf on Sept 14, 2021 21:17:52 GMT
On a series X one can use quick resume to make White Palace easier. You can't skip checkpoints of course, but neither do you have to dedicate an evening to doing it. Tip on how to make it easier still.
Combine this with the honey perk that refills life and your only obstacle to completing it is frustration. I didn't like the game when I first started it, but now I think it's amazing. One of the best games I've ever played in terms of atmosphere, presentation and world building. I think I'm at 94% completion or so. But it's been a while since I've played, so I don't think I'll have the muscle memory to defeat the final boss (again). |
|
|
|
Post by Danno on Sept 8, 2023 21:52:11 GMT
I'm back on this and got way further, I think. The Hornet is absolutely wrecking me at the moment though, that psuedo Malenia Waterfowl Dance is rotten
|
|
|
|
Post by JuniorFE on Sept 8, 2023 22:16:18 GMT
I'm back on this and got way further, I think. The Hornet is absolutely wrecking me at the moment though, that psuedo Malenia Waterfowl Dance is rottenJoke intended? |
|
|
|
Post by Danno on Sept 8, 2023 23:00:53 GMT
I'm back on this and got way further, I think. The Hornet is absolutely wrecking me at the moment though, that psuedo Malenia Waterfowl Dance is rottenJoke intended? Fuck there's a phase two? |
|
|
|
Post by JuniorFE on Sept 8, 2023 23:05:27 GMT
Fuck there's a phase two? AFAIK not for Hornet... I was referring to Malenia  |
|
|
|
Post by Danno on Sept 8, 2023 23:07:22 GMT
Fuck there's a phase two? AFAIK not for Hornet... I was referring to Malenia I hope so, I've sacked Hornet off for this evening |
|
|
|
Post by Aunt Alison on Sept 8, 2023 23:51:08 GMT
Is that the first fight with her? I started a new playthrough a couple of weeks ago. Just got to he mantis village
|
|
|
|
Post by Danno on Sept 8, 2023 23:56:22 GMT
Is that the first fight with her? I started a new playthrough a couple of weeks ago. Just got to he mantis village Yeah first fight as far as I know. Bwen a looooong while since I played anything like this (including anything 2d at all) so please excuse my shitness |
|
|
|
Post by Aunt Alison on Sept 9, 2023 0:02:23 GMT
Stick with it. You'll get the hang of it eventually. It's like a lot of genres, you'll develop a certain set of skills playing them that transfer to other games of the same type. When I get stuck on a boss, I tend to just focus on avoiding their attacks and surviving as long as possible without worrying too much about attacking. It's tempting to just go all in and hoping to finish them as quickly as possible before you die but it'll probably take just as long in the long run
|
|
|
|
Post by Zuluhero on Sept 9, 2023 10:28:43 GMT
Next to super metroid, it's one of my favourite games of all time.
Talking of Hornet, where on earth is Silksong?!?
|
|
|
|
Post by dangerousdave on Sept 9, 2023 11:14:14 GMT
It’s not going to live up to the hype at this rate. There is either some serious balancing going on in that game, or it had a complete overhaul.
I’ll still buy it, even it it turns out to be a poorly rated rhythm rogue like.
|
|
|
|
Post by Danno on Sept 9, 2023 13:35:02 GMT
Next to super metroid, it's one of my favourite games of all time. Talking of Hornet, where on earth is Silksong?!? Early 2024 apparently, but it's been delayed 2 or 3 times already |
|
Youthist
Junior Member
Enter your message here...
Posts: 1,984
|
Post by Youthist on Sept 9, 2023 13:39:23 GMT
Next to super metroid, it's one of my favourite games of all time. Talking of Hornet, where on earth is Silksong?!? Devs are still on the hookers and coke with the cash from HK, I think |
|
|
|
Post by Danno on Sept 9, 2023 15:31:02 GMT
Got her. Fun fight in the end, although I still can't work out the tell for her string attack.
Also bought a charm that extends my sword range and it might be the best thing ever, I'm not trading into damage anywhere near as much.
|
|
|
|
Post by Zuluhero on Sept 9, 2023 17:57:44 GMT
Yeah, charms can really change a fight, different ones better for different fights too, so keep experimenting and mixing it up
|
|
|
|
Post by Danno on Sept 10, 2023 19:56:55 GMT
The boss in the Soul Sanctuary (big version of the floaty wankers with orbs) has been absolutely handing my arse to me.
Goddamn this game is amazing though.*
*It could do with a ~smidge~ more in tutorials, I found out that smacking something downwards made you jump purely by accident while raging in a section with the purple bouncies. Also I absolutely suck at sword jumping or whatever it's called.
|
|
|
|
Post by Aunt Alison on Sept 10, 2023 20:03:50 GMT
The boss in the Soul Sanctuary (big version of the floaty wankers with orbs) has been absolutely handing my arse to me. Goddamn this game is amazing though.* *It could do with a ~smidge~ more in tutorials, I found out that smacking something downwards made you jump purely by accident while raging in a section with the purple bouncies. Also I absolutely suck at sword jumping or whatever it's called. You can get the nail from Hollow Knight as a weapon in Dead Cells and the downward attack works the same way and does criticals
|
|
|
|
Post by Danno on Sept 10, 2023 20:23:01 GMT
The boss in the Soul Sanctuary (big version of the floaty wankers with orbs) has been absolutely handing my arse to me. Goddamn this game is amazing though.* *It could do with a ~smidge~ more in tutorials, I found out that smacking something downwards made you jump purely by accident while raging in a section with the purple bouncies. Also I absolutely suck at sword jumping or whatever it's called. You can get the nail from Hollow Knight as a weapon in Dead Cells and the downward attack works the same way and does criticals
Any tips for Soul Master? That guy is a jerk. |
|
Rich
Junior Member
Posts: 1,988 
|
Post by Rich on Sept 10, 2023 20:38:15 GMT
Take your time and learn his patterns. He's a huge difficulty spike and I think a lot of people drop the game there. I know I almost did.
Also make sure your nail is upgraded. You can do it once before him.
|
|
cubby
Full Member
doesn't get subtext
Posts: 6,362
|
Post by cubby on Sept 10, 2023 20:45:19 GMT
Au contraire, I dropped this game way before that!
|
|
|
|
Post by Zuluhero on Sept 10, 2023 20:49:26 GMT
I always hit one boss hurdle in these games and Soul Master was definitely that.
A bit like O&S in Dark souls 😅
|
|
|
|
Post by Aunt Alison on Sept 10, 2023 20:52:52 GMT
Au contraire, I dropped this game way before that! Chump. One of the GOATs |
|
