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Post by simple on Sept 5, 2024 18:27:47 GMT
Its going to be very interesting to see how they handle the really bad stuff he’s been caught for at the end when they’ve got access to all those people
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 5, 2024 18:42:18 GMT
Read something the other day that said it goes up to the first step down.
Going to be funny seeing everyone being a company guy and then cutting to Bret just calling him a piece of shit.
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Post by simple on Sept 5, 2024 21:30:17 GMT
I suppose they can’t pile in too hard what with Netflix getting rights to all the Fed’s shows next year but Bret’s gonna Bret.
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 6, 2024 5:01:30 GMT
Have they said what's going to happen in January yet? Is the entire network being moved over or some?
Are the events free like now or just for those subbed to the highest Netflix tier?
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Post by zisssou on Sept 6, 2024 8:40:49 GMT
I kind of feel for people like Stone Cold, who's legacy is practically built on the Vince feud.
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Post by Resident Knievel on Sept 6, 2024 8:47:35 GMT
Feels like AEW really started to price gouge their US fans after the hot year of 2021, big mistake as they were still in a growth phase and it's had a gradual negative impact on ticket sales and viewers. TK should have probably waited until AEW had a big TV deal before capping AEW's growth like that.
2022 was a rough year for AEW with mass injuries impacting storylines, ROH stinking up the place and backstage drama - but treating your fans like cash machines probably had more of an impact than any of that on plateauing fan engagement.
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 6, 2024 9:01:28 GMT
I kind of feel for people like Stone Cold, who's legacy is practically built on the Vince feud. Guy will be fine. Saw that he's currently the biggest merchandise seller in wrestling this year. Those cat videos must be getting him new fans  |
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Post by simple on Sept 6, 2024 9:14:48 GMT
Road Warrior pops all round for Pancho and Macho
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Post by zisssou on Sept 6, 2024 9:17:28 GMT
I kind of feel for people like Stone Cold, who's legacy is practically built on the Vince feud. Guy will be fine. Saw that he's currently the biggest merchandise seller in wrestling this year. Those cat videos must be getting him new fans Of course, but it's not like he can go and talk about Vince in a positive manner, without getting a few... erm Steve.. but.. |
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Post by rhaegyr on Sept 6, 2024 10:10:57 GMT
Danielson saying he received a letter from WWE after filing a trademark for the 'YES' chant in late July saying he was infringing.
Incredibly petty but also understand that copyright law requires zealous enforcement to keep the copyright.
Bryan's barely (f ever) even used the word in AEW - it's the fans who chant it.
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Post by rhaegyr on Sept 6, 2024 10:12:27 GMT
Ooh, Bret on RAW next week too!
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Post by simple on Sept 6, 2024 10:14:48 GMT
Thats gotta be a tough piece of IP to defend if TK or Danielson got good enough lawyers to stand up and challenge it
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 6, 2024 10:24:33 GMT
Yeah it sucks but I remember him saying when he joined AEW that he wasn't allowed to do it himself only the fans.
Cody was smart in making sure he owned the rights to just about everything when he signed with AEW.
Though I see some unknown band are trying to seek damages over the use of "American Nightmare".
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Post by simple on Sept 6, 2024 10:32:48 GMT
I remember American Nightmare/Give Up The Ghost! I hadn’t realised they’d reformed though, and been active for 13 years since then.
They’ve got an album with a red cover and candy hearts on the front that was a brief success/cult hit in Kerramg circles about 25 years ago.
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Post by rockavitch on Sept 6, 2024 10:39:08 GMT
Let's not forget Bryan is a self confessed "big time liar", so pinch of salt and all that.
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richardiox
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Post by richardiox on Sept 6, 2024 10:39:24 GMT
Feels like AEW really started to price gouge their US fans after the hot year of 2021, big mistake as they were still in a growth phase and it's had a gradual negative impact on ticket sales and viewers. TK should have probably waited until AEW had a big TV deal before capping AEW's growth like that. 2022 was a rough year for AEW with mass injuries impacting storylines, ROH stinking up the place and backstage drama - but treating your fans like cash machines probably had more of an impact than any of that on plateauing fan engagement. Yep, this and also over saturation of the market by also having to tour the (inferior) Collision show and sometimes a separate Rampage... During a cost of living crisis with huge inflation of ticket prices. Add to that a more confusing product (4 new belts, RoH, Trios division etc) and the aforementioned injuries too - and it's no surprise they are dead in the water in terms of attendance. |
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Post by zisssou on Sept 6, 2024 11:11:53 GMT
I think they key takeaway is that it's very difficult to stay consistently good. The initial core audience made up of independent/NJPW fans are still there, but the fans that were sick of Vince's booking have switched back to WWE. And that includes myself. I watched the first 30 minutes of Dynamite this week and I had to switch it off. You don't grab an audience by having Daniel Garcia and an MJF straight off the bat.
AEW haven't got time to waste on Daniel Garcia. Sure, if you are on a high and growing your audience. But right now this isn't the time.
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Lizard
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Post by Lizard on Sept 6, 2024 17:53:42 GMT
I remember American Nightmare/Give Up The Ghost! I hadn’t realised they’d reformed though, and been active for 13 years since then. They’ve got an album with a red cover and candy hearts on the front that was a brief success/cult hit in Kerramg circles about 25 years ago. FWIW American Nightmare were hugely influential and popular within hardcore punk. Their first couple of records changed the scene. They also had to change their name to Give Up The Ghost after another American Nightmare, an old man band that moved in completely different musical circles, got all shitty and refused to live and let live. It caused them huge problems, and they're probably trying to forestall something similar happening again. |
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 6, 2024 20:36:36 GMT
According to dusty he owned the name back in WCW and signed it over to Cody.
Argument also seems odd as plenty of merch has had it larger than the bus that day Cody.
Not to mention the big arse writing on thy bus he travels about in.
Guess is the money has ran out.
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Post by Resident Knievel on Sept 6, 2024 21:36:46 GMT
I wouldn't have a big issue with AEW having so many belts if one was a women's tag  I think AEW has more than enough talent to fill 4 hours of live shows, but instead of developing an expanded women's division they're fine with Collision becoming a bit of a bangers only show where the undeveloped B-storylines are shoved. Toni Storm and Willow Nightingale have done a hell of a lot with what little they're given. There was even a point I thought they were hinting at mixed-tag belts which would have been a lot of fun - The Cole/Baker and Cassidy/Statlander tag teams were wasted. I know I'm whinging and I do still enjoy following AEW but it does feel like its not fully living up to its potential and its strengths and weaknesses have remained static for a while now. |
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richardiox
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Post by richardiox on Sept 6, 2024 22:11:55 GMT
Think it's almost irrelevant how well AEW can stack and hype the cards of their TV shows.
With 4 hours of live tapings a week and with ticket prices what they are they simply won't be able to fill arenas anymore. They are not big enough and weren't even before they went off the boil. Small crowds then kill the TV product. It's a vicious circle.
I really think they need to drop Collision and cut the roster by a third. Then half the belts...I just realised the other day they have an International title and a Continental title. Fucking idiotic. Totally drop any RoH cross pollination. Make it a focused product, less is more...how it was in those heady first 18 months.
Won't happen though, TKs balls, like most promotors, are in the vice of the network. And he is an ADHD "more is more" type hyperactive personality and the product absolutely reflects that. Calm the hell down!
On a related note, a desire for wrestling to be generally better should be promotion agnostic. Even when WWE was at its dogshit worst (late Vince era, most of the 2010s etc) I still wanted it to succeed - because I love it and have been watching since 1988. WWF at the time but I'd mark out if I found an NWA VHS because I just couldn't get enough of wrestling itself.
What I can't get my head around on social media nowadays is the levels of *hatred* for AEW and the desire to see it fail. There's a celebratory tone to the discourse when their viewership or attendance goes down. I mean, do you like watching pro wrestling or not is the question really. If WWE vanished overnight, would these same people start watching AEW.
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Post by simple on Sept 7, 2024 0:15:15 GMT
TNA has been good again for years but Impact being filmed in front of 50 people absolutely kills the product stone dead. Joe Hendry and Jordynne Grace haven’t done anything new in NXT but with a hot crowd behind them they looked like superstars.
I don’t think AEW will sink that low anything soon but you need a solid live audience to sell the show to the tv one.
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 7, 2024 6:47:54 GMT
Do the weekly TNA crowd get in for free? Cause I saw clips of this week's crowd and it was dreadful.
Grace is taken out in the dark and when the lights came back on all you could hear was some kid doing a wee want tables chant by himself.
Hoping NXT does more weekly shows on the road to get away from the performance centre crowd.
Vinci first match on SD... fuck you hunter.
Hopefully they keep Cody away from the Bloodline after next week.
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Post by simple on Sept 7, 2024 7:25:13 GMT
Half of them look like they’ve been snatched off the street against their will most weeks.
Its a real shame because they have guys who are super over with the crowd but if you’re super over in front of 25 people its still sounds like crickets on tv.
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 7, 2024 9:49:19 GMT
Yeah some of the crowd just seem so uninterested in what's going on which sucks.
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richardiox
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Post by richardiox on Sept 7, 2024 10:43:31 GMT
When WCW used to tape at Universal Studios is the best example of this, crowds just attending as part of their day out at a theme park.
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Post by zisssou on Sept 7, 2024 11:27:37 GMT
Think it's almost irrelevant how well AEW can stack and hype the cards of their TV shows. With 4 hours of live tapings a week and with ticket prices what they are they simply won't be able to fill arenas anymore. They are not big enough and weren't even before they went off the boil. Small crowds then kill the TV product. It's a vicious circle. I really think they need to drop Collision and cut the roster by a third. Then half the belts...I just realised the other day they have an International title and a Continental title. Fucking idiotic. Totally drop any RoH cross pollination. Make it a focused product, less is more...how it was in those heady first 18 months. Won't happen though, TKs balls, like most promotors, are in the vice of the network. And he is an ADHD "more is more" type hyperactive personality and the product absolutely reflects that. Calm the hell down! On a related note, a desire for wrestling to be generally better should be promotion agnostic. Even when WWE was at its dogshit worst (late Vince era, most of the 2010s etc) I still wanted it to succeed - because I love it and have been watching since 1988. WWF at the time but I'd mark out if I found an NWA VHS because I just couldn't get enough of wrestling itself. What I can't get my head around on social media nowadays is the levels of *hatred* for AEW and the desire to see it fail. There's a celebratory tone to the discourse when their viewership or attendance goes down. I mean, do you like watching pro wrestling or not is the question really. If WWE vanished overnight, would these same people start watching AEW. I want it to succeed, but there was a giant kick in the bollocks when all the backstage drama was kicking up. It drained my passion and a lot of other fans judging from reading online. Not to mention that whenever TK makes a signing they come on the first week, then disappear for a few weeks. A recent example how’s Ricochet supposed to get over? That pisses me and a lot of people off. Also TK has done the dirty with Brit Baker, Wardlow, Ricky Starks to name a few. |
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 7, 2024 11:37:49 GMT
You can probably guess who Ricochet first feud is reportedly with ...
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richardiox
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Post by richardiox on Sept 7, 2024 12:04:13 GMT
Think it's almost irrelevant how well AEW can stack and hype the cards of their TV shows. With 4 hours of live tapings a week and with ticket prices what they are they simply won't be able to fill arenas anymore. They are not big enough and weren't even before they went off the boil. Small crowds then kill the TV product. It's a vicious circle. I really think they need to drop Collision and cut the roster by a third. Then half the belts...I just realised the other day they have an International title and a Continental title. Fucking idiotic. Totally drop any RoH cross pollination. Make it a focused product, less is more...how it was in those heady first 18 months. Won't happen though, TKs balls, like most promotors, are in the vice of the network. And he is an ADHD "more is more" type hyperactive personality and the product absolutely reflects that. Calm the hell down! On a related note, a desire for wrestling to be generally better should be promotion agnostic. Even when WWE was at its dogshit worst (late Vince era, most of the 2010s etc) I still wanted it to succeed - because I love it and have been watching since 1988. WWF at the time but I'd mark out if I found an NWA VHS because I just couldn't get enough of wrestling itself. What I can't get my head around on social media nowadays is the levels of *hatred* for AEW and the desire to see it fail. There's a celebratory tone to the discourse when their viewership or attendance goes down. I mean, do you like watching pro wrestling or not is the question really. If WWE vanished overnight, would these same people start watching AEW. I want it to succeed, but there was a giant kick in the bollocks when all the backstage drama was kicking up. It drained my passion and a lot of other fans judging from reading online. Not to mention that whenever TK makes a signing they come on the first week, then disappear for a few weeks. A recent example how’s Ricochet supposed to get over? That pisses me and a lot of people off. Also TK has done the dirty with Brit Baker, Wardlow, Ricky Starks to name a few. My post wasn't aimed at you, it was more an observation of the general discourse I see online. There's a huge swathe of WWE fans who actively want AEW to go out of business... because they're not WWE. It's bizarre for any wrestling fan to want a promotion to die. The things you listed (which I agree with) all also happened over last 30yrs of WWE under Vince, but people still watched and supported the product. |
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Post by zisssou on Sept 7, 2024 18:20:01 GMT
I want it to succeed, but there was a giant kick in the bollocks when all the backstage drama was kicking up. It drained my passion and a lot of other fans judging from reading online. Not to mention that whenever TK makes a signing they come on the first week, then disappear for a few weeks. A recent example how’s Ricochet supposed to get over? That pisses me and a lot of people off. Also TK has done the dirty with Brit Baker, Wardlow, Ricky Starks to name a few. My post wasn't aimed at you, it was more an observation of the general discourse I see online. There's a huge swathe of WWE fans who actively want AEW to go out of business... because they're not WWE. It's bizarre for any wrestling fan to want a promotion to die. The things you listed (which I agree with) all also happened over last 30yrs of WWE under Vince, but people still watched and supported the product. Oh I know. I was a TNA fan from 2004-2011 and it was the same people who laughed at TNA. In the end if they don’t have anything constructive to say, then it’s an ignore. |
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