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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 24, 2024 9:55:25 GMT
That is incredible. I mean Arsenal have been blocking off keepers and fouling players in the box, pulling people back from blocking, getting away with penalty shouts for the last year and a half but City are the worst tactical foulers in the league, Rodri and his fellow midfield compatriots like Silva have a yellow card resistant teflon coating. Just do the obvious foul in the opponents defensive third before they get to midfield and you're golden apparently. Ben White undoing the keepers gloves aside, most of those corner tactics aren't "dark arts", they're legit strategy it's just that many people don't know the rules. Frankly I only know them because I went and read them carefully once we started doing all this convoluted stuff to better understand where the line actually is. Before the corner is taken, attackers are allowed to take up awkward positions designed to block the keeper and be massively inconvenient for the defenders. After it is kicked you are entitled to stand your ground even if you are blocking. If you move into a space that blocks the defender, but are making a reasonable attempt to compete for the ball you also aren't blocking. What you can't do is move into positions that block the defenders or keeper once the ball is in play without making a legit effort to compete for it. Not saying those rules make sense, but that's my understanding. They are massively stacked in the attacking teams favour and it's actually more surprising that teams haven't exploited them sooner. Nowhere does it say defenders can put their arms around, push or hold attackers (as literally every defending side does at every corner) but I guess refs permit that because otherwise the attacking team would have even greater advantage and it'd barely be a contest. |
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 24, 2024 10:02:23 GMT
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Post by Dougs on Sept 24, 2024 10:04:45 GMT
Ben White undoing the keepers gloves is still hilarious
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 24, 2024 10:06:40 GMT
I thought someone was going to make a joke about Partey and well he has previous of having a rapist touch. I'll leave now. Where's Pardew when you need him. |
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 24, 2024 10:07:45 GMT
That is incredible. I mean Arsenal have been blocking off keepers and fouling players in the box, pulling people back from blocking, getting away with penalty shouts for the last year and a half but City are the worst tactical foulers in the league, Rodri and his fellow midfield compatriots like Silva have a yellow card resistant teflon coating. Just do the obvious foul in the opponents defensive third before they get to midfield and you're golden apparently. Ben White undoing the keepers gloves aside, most of those corner tactics aren't "dark arts", they're legit strategy it's just that many people don't know the rules. Frankly I only know them because I went and read them carefully once we started doing all this convoluted stuff to better understand where the line actually is. Before the corner is taken, attackers are allowed to take up awkward positions designed to block the keeper and be massively inconvenient for the defenders. After it is kicked you are entitled to stand your ground even if you are blocking. If you move into a space that blocks the defender, but are making a reasonable attempt to compete for the ball you also aren't blocking. What you can't do is move into positions that block the defenders or keeper once the ball is in play without making a legit effort to compete for it. Not saying those rules make sense, but that's my understanding. They are massively stacked in the attacking teams favour and it's actually more surprising that teams haven't exploited them sooner. Nowhere does it say defenders can put their arms around, push or hold attackers (as literally every defending side does at every corner) but I guess refs permit that because otherwise the attacking team would have even greater advantage and it'd barely be a contest. And actually the rules are probably written as they are because they are bilateral. Same rules around starting positions and what constitutes blocking applies to defenders, it's just when they do it we all consider it defending. |
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 24, 2024 10:16:27 GMT
I certainly don't think we have a leg to stand on regarding the dark arts accusations for Sunday though, it's a fair cop.
My favourite: Lewis-Skelly got booked for running down the touchline and behind the goal. Apparently he told Raya to go down so they could have a team talk. It seems entirely probable that Arteta would send the 17 year old kid he thought would be unlikely to play (but unlike the backup keeper, could plausibly need to stay warm) to take the hit.
The fact that genuine cramping meant that he actually did have to make his PL debut away at City whilst already on a booking was karma.
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Post by Dougs on Sept 24, 2024 10:18:10 GMT
I was waiting for him to get sent off, to make the ultimate pub quiz question.
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Post by rhaegyr on Sept 24, 2024 10:18:21 GMT
I must have read the word "housery" 100+ times since this match.
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Post by mikew1985 on Sept 24, 2024 10:56:28 GMT
That is incredible. I mean Arsenal have been blocking off keepers and fouling players in the box, pulling people back from blocking, getting away with penalty shouts for the last year and a half but City are the worst tactical foulers in the league, Rodri and his fellow midfield compatriots like Silva have a yellow card resistant teflon coating. Just do the obvious foul in the opponents defensive third before they get to midfield and you're golden apparently. Ben White undoing the keepers gloves aside, most of those corner tactics aren't "dark arts", they're legit strategy it's just that many people don't know the rules. Frankly I only know them because I went and read them carefully once we started doing all this convoluted stuff to better understand where the line actually is. Before the corner is taken, attackers are allowed to take up awkward positions designed to block the keeper and be massively inconvenient for the defenders. After it is kicked you are entitled to stand your ground even if you are blocking. If you move into a space that blocks the defender, but are making a reasonable attempt to compete for the ball you also aren't blocking. What you can't do is move into positions that block the defenders or keeper once the ball is in play without making a legit effort to compete for it. Not saying those rules make sense, but that's my understanding. They are massively stacked in the attacking teams favour and it's actually more surprising that teams haven't exploited them sooner. Nowhere does it say defenders can put their arms around, push or hold attackers (as literally every defending side does at every corner) but I guess refs permit that because otherwise the attacking team would have even greater advantage and it'd barely be a contest. I admire their corner tactic from the other day. It looks so obvious - block the keeper, loop a ball to the back post but it's a fair amount of effort to coordinate and execute all of that to that high a level. They have stepped over the line and gotten away with it on occasion. Not to mention that game but the United one last season, Evans (I think it was) is 100% fouled trying to block Rice. They regularly operate in the grey but they're brilliant at it and most top teams find an extra edge which is what it currently is. |
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Post by mikew1985 on Sept 24, 2024 10:58:45 GMT
I wouldn't agree with Arsenal falling short being a correct categorisation but the Jose tag is fair and not just for this game, in general. Moyes might be a fairer one tbh given his management has to be one of the biggest influences on Arteta but that's a little less glamourous. |
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Frog
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Post by Frog on Sept 24, 2024 11:07:12 GMT
The ball in play stat isn't really relevant because a lot of the half was city passing it about outside your box. You used every chance you were near it to waste time.
Which is totally what I would expect anyone playing city to do when they are winning. The injured player that went down a second time was a bit much though.
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Post by Dougs on Sept 24, 2024 11:27:33 GMT
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 24, 2024 11:35:54 GMT
The ball in play stat isn't really relevant because a lot of the half was city passing it about outside your box. You used every chance you were near it to waste time. Which is totally what I would expect anyone playing city to do when they are winning. The injured player that went down a second time was a bit much though. We definitely intentionally disrupted their rhythm but the ball in play stat is relevant because it shows that City had even more time than 'normal' to try and break us down. There were shenanigans (Raya especially) but some of the cramping was genuine evidenced by the fact we did have to take them off and were forced into subbing on a 17 year old. It was hardly surprising given the amount of work required with a man down and following a Thursday night game. |
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zisssou
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Post by zisssou on Sept 24, 2024 11:40:23 GMT
We are Stoke!
Let's all do the Guardiola NAAA NAAA NAAA NAAA
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RobEG
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Post by RobEG on Sept 24, 2024 12:17:20 GMT
The thing that impressed me about Arsenal's corners is the quality of the delivery is absolutely spot on almost every time. The goal was a carbon copy of a previous corner that Gabriel headed over. It's a clever set up and positioning of players, but its pointless if the delivery isn't right.
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askew
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Post by askew on Sept 24, 2024 13:01:50 GMT
Ugh. Think Timber looked the worst.
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 24, 2024 17:01:37 GMT
Mosquera out for the season too.
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zisssou
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Post by zisssou on Sept 24, 2024 17:58:37 GMT
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jono62
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Post by jono62 on Sept 24, 2024 20:16:40 GMT
Arteta has gone all Rafa.
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mcmonkeyplc
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General Martok Qapla!
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Post by mcmonkeyplc on Sept 25, 2024 8:19:55 GMT
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Post by mikew1985 on Sept 25, 2024 9:15:57 GMT
Great player, dogged by injury issues the last few years but when he did play for us was usually very good. It's a shame for him but he's had a hell of a career nonetheless! |
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Post by Dougs on Sept 25, 2024 10:21:19 GMT
Wrong thread but Pep's comments on EFL Cup are more than a little disheartening. They can of course trot out a second string that virtually every other club would have as starters but still. It's derogatory and I don't like it.
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Post by mikew1985 on Sept 25, 2024 10:28:33 GMT
It's also a little disingenuous given as you've correctly said, his second string will put most other teams to shame. He's still putting out a team with a very high % chance of a win. It's bollocks from him as always.
He's such a snide, obnoxious little prick.
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zisssou
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Post by zisssou on Sept 25, 2024 10:31:13 GMT
Not wasting energy.. yet plays Foden, Stones, Doku, Grealish, Savinho..
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Post by muddyfunster on Sept 25, 2024 11:06:17 GMT
Personally I don't mind Pep's comments in this instance. He means it and I'd rather managers were honest rather than treated us like idiots. The league cup is absolutely not worth jeopardising your league or UCL campaign when you have ambitions of winning both.
Ironically this state of affairs favours City and Chelsea as the only sides with a second XI about as good as their first XI.
God knows what Arteta will do in our case as we've only got 4 available players in the first team squad who need minutes rather than rest. Hope he plays 7 academy kids I've never heard of but that's not normally his style.
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Post by Dougs on Sept 25, 2024 12:54:02 GMT
I think Nwanieri, Heaven and Skelly will start but that's it from the Academy. Looking forward to it, first game of the season for me. Poor show.
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Post by pierrepressure on Sept 25, 2024 13:26:03 GMT
16 year old keeper playing tonight 😂
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deez
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Post by deez on Sept 25, 2024 13:59:02 GMT
Carabou cup is clearly a tier 2 contest but most prem teams would value the opportunity for fringe players to get experience.
He's being a prick about but the real problem is the insane expansion of the champions league that hoovers up all available time for it's contestants. That should be what he moans about.
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zisssou
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Post by zisssou on Sept 25, 2024 14:45:54 GMT
I'm having flashbacks of Fat Sam and Bolton.
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Post by Dougs on Sept 25, 2024 14:51:17 GMT
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