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Post by Jambowayoh on May 15, 2024 10:45:09 GMT
Call me cynical but when a business comes out with thinly veiled article that promotes their business I'm not always going to take what they say as gospel.
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apollo
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Post by apollo on May 15, 2024 12:44:28 GMT
listening to the jeff gertsman podcast today and he mentioned about Playground didn't have the fable type humour in early versions of the game. Also he mentioned MS have created gamers who will not buy games but wait till its on GP (I still buy games but do wait for certain games to go on GP)
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Post by baihu1983 on May 15, 2024 13:25:56 GMT
Still say the big games should have gone on Game Pass 3-6 months after release.
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Frog
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Post by Frog on May 15, 2024 14:04:20 GMT
Charging 70 notes for a game is as much to blame for that. I'm much less likely to take a punt on a game at the price. Stellar blade for example I may have bought. Glad I didn't though as I played the demo and it's shite.
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Post by baihu1983 on May 15, 2024 14:05:32 GMT
I miss Demos/Trials.
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Derblington
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Post by Derblington on May 15, 2024 14:10:16 GMT
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Post by A46Matt on May 15, 2024 14:36:10 GMT
I think there’s also a case of people having ever growing back logs and are happy to wait years at times before picking a game up. One of the downsides to backwards compatibility, for the game makers anyway. On Xbox we’ve got 4 generations of games where most if not all are available to play and the majority of those, 360 onwards anyway, still hold up well today.
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Post by paulyboy81 on May 15, 2024 15:05:29 GMT
Good article, interesting that they also earmark PlayStation as suffering from some of the same audience ambivalence to a degree and PS+ deals being the only worthwhile route for some smaller games. I'm a big fan of the value subscriptions offer (I've got a lot out of Game Pass over the years), but there's no denying the complete purchasing apathy they're breeding amongst consumers, same goes for the entire entertainment industry really.
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Post by Bill in the rain on May 15, 2024 15:18:41 GMT
Pretty much everything on Switch seems to have a demo. (may be an exaggeration, can't be bothered to check)
Do other platforms do it?
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Post by baihu1983 on May 15, 2024 15:21:27 GMT
Pretty much everything on Switch seems to have a demo. (may be an exaggeration, can't be bothered to check)
Do other platforms do it?
Very rare on Xbox. Used to be every XBLA game was required to have one. Think Penny's Big Breakaway was the last game I saw a demo for. Not sure about PS or Switch(which I need to find as it's no doubt flat now as i left it packed when i took it on holiday last October).
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Ulythium
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Post by Ulythium on May 15, 2024 15:22:36 GMT
Demos on PlayStation are very much the exception, not the norm.
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Post by Jambowayoh on May 15, 2024 15:29:19 GMT
I think there's an argument that gaming has been devalued over the years, when you think of the outgoing generation namely us and the incoming generation namely kids and teens they're used to free game and all that nonsense that comes with it. When I think of how cheap games can get and things like Gamepass and PS Plus, realistically speaking, why would you pay full whack for games these days???
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Post by Bill in the rain on May 15, 2024 15:34:50 GMT
I'm not sure I've paid over $5 for a game for myself in the last 15 years, so the idea of $70 games is insane to me. Between Steam Sales, Epic etc.. giveaways and Humble Bundles (not so much recently), a game has to be pretty darn appealing to get me to pay over $1!
The only games I've bought at $50ish prices have been Switch games for kids birthdays, and usually they play them for a week and then go back to playing Fortnite, Minecraft or Roblox every day.
I guess Minecraft was $15, so that's been a bargain.
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technoish
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Post by technoish on May 15, 2024 16:05:54 GMT
Hogwarts legacy is the only game I've bought, I think, for years. Oh and the marvel live service one.
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apollo
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Post by apollo on May 15, 2024 17:12:45 GMT
Any game should have a trial like in the XBLA days as most people want to test the game to see how it plays, add in the lack of demos. Devs and publishers don't want you to test the game, they expect you to buy it with almost no option of refund on consoles.
There is some gamers that are happy to lose demos, they do mental backflips taking companies side. You would often see threads on forums about gamers hating on demos but barely could write a sentence why
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Post by gibroon on May 15, 2024 17:23:11 GMT
I'm all for saving some money and waiting a few months for cheaper games or even waiting till they appear "free" in a subscription service, however, I do like to splash some cash on games I really like.
I personally think it's important to support your hobby now and again rather than always waiting for bargain basement prices. If you are happy with Fortnite/apex or candy crush stuff then fine.
Smaller indy stuff like Animal wall should also be fine as they are made by passionate folk.
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Post by baihu1983 on May 15, 2024 17:42:39 GMT
Speaking of XBLA.
I really wish MS would go back to giving the smaller titles a separate section on the store. The new games page is filled with what would have been XBLA games back on the 360 with the bigger releases lost in between them all.
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Post by Resident Knievel on May 15, 2024 22:15:11 GMT
Last game I paid full whack for at launch was Total Warhammer 3. I regretted that as it was a boring mess for about a year.
I was going to get Dragons Dogma 2 at launch but Witcher 3 has got in the way, which I got for a tenner. Why buy a game at full price when there's hundreds of great games I've never played before I can get for cheap?
Edit: wait, I bought TOTK at launch, no regrets with that one
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Post by dangerousdave on May 16, 2024 4:04:10 GMT
I am happy spending £40 - £50 on a big game if I am genuinely hyped for it.
My brain is still influenced by the perceived value of things. If I spend £45 on a game, I’m more likely to give it a fair shake of the stick and do my best to enjoy it. If I’ve paid a fiver for it, I’m more likely to drop it if it doesn’t quickly win me over.
It’s not logical, but it just seems to be how I am hardwired. I have to try and get my money’s worth out of something if I can.
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Frog
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Post by Frog on May 16, 2024 5:09:44 GMT
On one hand people are really outraged that all these studios are closing, on the other hand they are like I only ever spend £6 on a game. I can't work out how these 2 things might be in some way linked!
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Post by Dougs on May 16, 2024 5:50:28 GMT
How do the economics of Gamepass/PS+ work too? Presumably the publisher or studio gets a better cut if games have been bought, even on discount. Much like streaming, the model seems broken.
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Post by Bill in the rain on May 16, 2024 5:53:10 GMT
I don't think they are particularly linked, unless we're classing games companies as charities now, and we should be paying them more than they ask for.
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Frog
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Post by Frog on May 16, 2024 7:08:07 GMT
I think they probably are linked. At the point you (we) are paying that for a game, the fate of a studio is probably sealed due to lower sales than expectations.
It's like the chap from bend citing days gone sales numbers against horizon. Similar sales but horizons were front loaded and days gone was mostly bargain basement.
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Post by Bill in the rain on May 16, 2024 7:17:12 GMT
It has been decades since I've felt the need to buy a game at launch. Once that is removed, there's not really any reason to pay $70 for a game this week that I won't play for months, when I could buy the same game for $5 six months later and not play it for months. But it's the games companies/publishers/retailers who are setting the prices, nothing to do with me. If most Switch games get discounted to 75% off every 2 weeks, I'm not going to buy them at full price just to somehow support the company. (I have paid more than the minimum for some bundles, but that was mainly to support the charity) [edit] If anything, games companies should refund all the money I've spent on games that I haven't played!
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Frog
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Post by Frog on May 16, 2024 7:25:19 GMT
Oh I'm not saying you are doing anything wrong, we all have our own decisions we make about what something is worth.
My point is that the game market is bigger than people's spending is willing to support. A lot of people are one or two game gamers as well.
Publishers are wanting returns on the games the publish. Although I do think any title that covers it's costs shouldn't result in a studio disappearing.
Don't get me wrong I think the behaviour of some (most) publisher's is awful but there are too many games being made at the moment.
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Post by Jambowayoh on May 16, 2024 7:33:10 GMT
Yeah I did read about how many games are being released on Steam and how hard it is to actually get seen. Like yes, it's great that a single person made game such as Manor Born does really well but the reality is that it's really just a drop in the ocean with how many games are being made all looking to dominate our time and how many just don't sell and wither away.
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Post by baihu1983 on May 16, 2024 7:38:22 GMT
How do the economics of Gamepass/PS+ work too? Presumably the publisher or studio gets a better cut if games have been bought, even on discount. Much like streaming, the model seems broken. With 3rd party games they pay an agreed fee based how how many sales they think will be lost due to game pass. No idea how they look at it in regards to first party.
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Post by Bill in the rain on May 16, 2024 7:40:16 GMT
Not only is it so much easier to make and publish a game these days, they're also in competition with all other media, plus also all other games and media that have ever been (except NolF!)
It used to be that only relatively big publishers had the ability to get physical games into stores, and stores would mostly stock newer games. So buyers were almost forced to buy newer games.
But now you can go on somewhere like Steam and not only get newer big games, but all the newer smaller games, plus all the older big games and older smaller games.
Tbh I'm rather surprised that big new games still seem to be able to pull in huge numbers of sales. I guess it's mainly due to the fact that the amount of people playing games has dramatically expanded. (no longer just teen boys). And I guess there's still quite a few people who want to be part of that initial launch zeitgeist.
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Frog
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Post by Frog on May 16, 2024 7:45:18 GMT
To prove Jambos point, I've never heard of manor born.
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Post by Jambowayoh on May 16, 2024 7:46:13 GMT
I would also say the dramatic rise in streaming has contributed heavily to certain games being massive. The usual suspects such as COD,FIFA(EA FC) and such do well truthfully because they are made extremely well and don't really deviate on their gameplay which people do like and want more of.
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