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Post by rhaegyr on Sept 9, 2024 14:51:44 GMT
She's always been awful.
Outside of a couple of matches with Bayley during NXT's heyday (specifically the Takeover match) she offers nothing. Still doesn't imo.
I'm guessing that people who watched only WWE rated her as their women's division was that bad until the Divas championshipo was retired and wrestlers like Flair, Bayley and Banks came along who could at least go in the ring.
If you'd seen anything from Shimmer, Stardom or even Gail Kim tearing it up in TNA you were probably left scratching your head and wondering what the fuss was all about.
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 9, 2024 14:55:10 GMT
Much better than the stupid CEO chant from about 2 people.
Though doesn't need Mone every 3 seconds.
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Post by simple on Sept 9, 2024 15:16:27 GMT
I think those NXT women were a match for what the Knockouts had delivered. It might’ve been new to WWE but wasn’t just “good for WWE” it was genuinely good.
Takeover Brooklyn? The Iron Woman match? They were genuine MOTY contenders
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 9, 2024 15:19:06 GMT
Kim was such a talent. I remember reading how she was the female Rey Mysterio before her WWE debut only for her to be completely wasted.
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Post by simple on Sept 9, 2024 15:26:15 GMT
I think her match against Taryn Terrell at Slammiversary was the first women’s match I can remember getting holy shit chants. It was an absolute showstealer at the time.
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Post by zisssou on Sept 9, 2024 15:33:45 GMT
It's no Torrie Wilson vs Stacy Keibler bra & panties match though.
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Post by rhaegyr on Sept 9, 2024 15:35:05 GMT
I think those NXT women were a match for what the Knockouts had delivered. It might’ve been new to WWE but wasn’t just “good for WWE” it was genuinely good. Takeover Brooklyn? The Iron Woman match? They were genuine MOTY contenders In all fairness I did mention the NXT matches in my post. Agree that they were similar in quality to the Knockouts division but still maintain they fell short when comparing to Shimmer and Stardom's heydays. Sara Del Rey was putting on bangers in Shimmer before Mone even had her first match in NXT. |
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Post by rawshark on Sept 9, 2024 17:23:23 GMT
I thought she was decent in WWE but she had good chemistry with the roster there. Maybe she’s just a bad fit in AEW.
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Post by zisssou on Sept 9, 2024 18:20:09 GMT
I’m sorry but that needle spot. What the fuck… that is actually quite disturbing.
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Post by zisssou on Sept 9, 2024 18:23:10 GMT
How is that even a thing. There’s a blur between wrestling and reality. Why don’t we always just stab someone with a needle, or get a gun. This is exactly what I was saying about turning potential fans away with this utter ridiculous booking. Absolutely minus 5 stars. Terrible.
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richardiox
Junior Member
Semi proficient
Posts: 1,658
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Post by richardiox on Sept 9, 2024 18:54:20 GMT
In Kayfabe it was a lights out match so conventional wrestling wisdom/rules don't apply. In reality it again shows how far removed TK is from most fans and actually growing the audience of AEW. I absolutely hate all the "death match" bollocks, hated it in WWF attitude era, hated it in ECW and hate it now.
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 9, 2024 18:56:16 GMT
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Post by zisssou on Sept 9, 2024 19:18:48 GMT
In Kayfabe it was a lights out match so conventional wrestling wisdom/rules don't apply. In reality it again shows how far removed TK in from most fans and actually growing the audience of AEW. I absolutely hate all the "death match" bollocks, hated it in WWF attitude era, hated it in ECW and hate it now. Yeah I get the lights out stipulation, but I still think there is smacking someone with a light tube, or going through a table, or hitting them with barb wire.. but needles? That’s just too far for me. |
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richardiox
Junior Member
Semi proficient
Posts: 1,658
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Post by richardiox on Sept 9, 2024 21:19:19 GMT
Me too, I can watch matches like Osprey PAC all day but fucked if I'm watching that main event.
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Post by rockavitch on Sept 10, 2024 6:01:11 GMT
One of the top reasons I don't watch, trying to hard at times to be "edgy". My 13 year old self would've loved it though.
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 10, 2024 6:11:00 GMT
You could take out that bit and the chair shot and the match still has impact.
But they need to be getting those stars..
SD staying 2hrs and from next month till the end of 2024 Raw will be 2hrs.
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Post by zisssou on Sept 10, 2024 7:26:23 GMT
Just when RAW started becoming watchable at 3hrs…
That was comedy gold with Gunther saying his number 1 is Goldberg. And keeping Punk off tv this week is a nice slow build to the Hell in a Cell.
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 10, 2024 7:47:27 GMT
Yeah HHH has pretty much nailed the 3hr show over the last couple months.
Lot of talent going to struggle to get on TV. Sounds like it's a network decision rather than WWE.
I don't like how they keep making Gunther look weak in brawls. I know he's the heel but they have only started doing this since he moved up to the WHC scene.
Hopefully Liv can start defending against others after BB. No reason to keep dragging it out with Rhea. Maybe someone can cost her the match? Raquel must be due back soon.
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Post by rhaegyr on Sept 10, 2024 8:16:14 GMT
Sadistic heel Moxley - it's about damn time  Really looking forward to seeing how this pans out. Not as fussed as you guys about the syringe - it's a daft gimmick but planned/safe and nothing worse than you'd see in the territory days or ECW. Ditto the trick chair shot. I'd rather they weren't in the match as it's all a bit CZW for my tastes but hopefully they draw a line under this feud for a while now as I'm not sure where you go after that. I'm more pissed off at the powerbomb on the cinder block which is fucking ridiculous - protect your health guys, there's absolutely no way to take a bump like this safely. Really made me wince. |
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Post by zisssou on Sept 10, 2024 8:22:18 GMT
Was it a trick chair shot? I haven't watched it back since, and not likely too either. My strong opinion is that I thought we left a lot of this behind in the 90s. Even the piledriver by MJF and Garcia is pretty stupid, no matter how much you say it's safe. One slip and you are fucked.
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Post by rawshark on Sept 10, 2024 8:40:01 GMT
In Kayfabe it was a lights out match so conventional wrestling wisdom/rules don't apply. In reality it again shows how far removed TK in from most fans and actually growing the audience of AEW. I absolutely hate all the "death match" bollocks, hated it in WWF attitude era, hated it in ECW and hate it now. Yeah I get the lights out stipulation, but I still think there is smacking someone with a light tube, or going through a table, or hitting them with barb wire.. but needles? That’s just too far for me. I haven’t seen this but anything involving stabbing is too far for me. I didn’t like screwdrivers being used in the feud between Christopher Daniels and AJ Styles back in the day (even if it was only the threat of them being used), Tank Abbot pulling a knife after a match was rightfully condemned even at the time, and the New Jack v Gypsy Joe match probably should have resulted in jail time. David Arquette getting his artery gouged by Nick Gage as well. Dude could have died. |
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Post by rhaegyr on Sept 10, 2024 8:43:59 GMT
Yeah it was a trick chair. Don't think any promoter, even TK, is daft enough to allow an unprotected chair shot in this day and age.
Don't agree about the piledriver - move's been used for decades and works well when done sparingly and safely. Agree you're potentially fucked if you slip up while doing it but that's true of a whole lot of moves.
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 10, 2024 8:44:57 GMT
I keep seeing "it's a gimmicked chair". It was designed to break but that's it.
AEW fans arguing with former wrestlers/refs who have called out the spot.
We've seen too much fallout from the late 90s days to still be doing unprotected shots to the head. It's one reason why the attitude era has aged so poorly.
Bret giving 0 fucks is always funny
And yeah fine with the piledriver as long as it's not done in some really stupid spot/situation.
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Post by rhaegyr on Sept 10, 2024 8:48:23 GMT
Really appreciate whoever talked Bret out of wearing jean shorts.
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 10, 2024 8:56:58 GMT
It's highly unlikely it was taken by a WWE employee. To be honest I'm more surprised a pic like this hasn't come out before.
But then plenty of video for documentaries shows wrestlers hanging out. Hell the WM doc for 39 showed KO/Sami and the Usos casually talking in the background in a bit with Becky.
Not to mention the PPV Rock Bottom having some of my funniest mistakes showing Rock and Mankind chilling in at least 3 backstage bits. One as Vince was leaving a cupboard after having just had a chat with mankind.
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Post by rawshark on Sept 10, 2024 9:12:58 GMT
I can’t remember who was on camera for it but I love the infamous blooper of Road Warrior Hawk not realising an interview was taking place and coming through a door right behind them before skulking back out of view.
Just checked: It was Sunny interviewing Vader.
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Post by zisssou on Sept 10, 2024 9:24:06 GMT
Yeah it was a trick chair. Don't think any promoter, even TK, is daft enough to allow an unprotected chair shot in this day and age. Don't agree about the piledriver - move's been used for decades and works well when done sparingly and safely. Agree you're potentially fucked if you slip up while doing it but that's true of a whole lot of moves. Didn't Shawn Spears give Cody an unprotected chair shot? Tony's booking is for shock, would you not agree? What we know about concussions. Anything head related should be reduced and not for shock. |
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Post by baihu1983 on Sept 10, 2024 9:31:44 GMT
Yeah he caught Cody on the side and busted him open.
He told Cody before to protect himself but Cody said no.
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Post by zisssou on Sept 10, 2024 9:36:01 GMT
But, then that info should be relayed back to Tony, no? Cause I know what we'll say.. that's between Cody and Shawn, but Tony and the agents should be there to say.. no don't do it.
Actually, the same as that stupid fire table spot Brandi and Cody did. Who thought that was a good idea?
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Post by rhaegyr on Sept 10, 2024 9:42:21 GMT
My guess would be Tony doesn't book the specifics of the matches - he lets the wrestlers have free reign to do what they want which is both a blessing and a curse. His booking in general is quite over the top though - guy's obviously an Attitude era fan. I think most of the roster is too (they grew up during it), hence why you see a lot of similar spots in AEW.
He did at Cody's request - I remember Cody saying he tried to prove that they could do safe chair shots to the head but completely fucked it up. Basically admitted the whole thing was his fault. Cody said Moxley and Tony Khan actually ripped Spears to shreds for doing it so I guess that's something in TK's favour.
Totally agree that anything concussion related should be avoided. I remember Lesnar destroying Orton at Summerslam, making him bleed the hard way and thinking "what the hell?". Moxley has tried to implement a system for spotting concussions mid-match, not sure if anything came from it though.
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Really looking forward to seeing how this pans out.